Backwards Compatibility in Consoles

[Icy]

So how important is it to you guys? I really don't understand why everyone is so mad the Wii U won't play GameCube games. That was TWO GENERATIONS AGO.

Be happy it plays Wii stuff.

See, the GameCube didn't play N64 games. Did anyone cry? I don't think so. Not as much as they do today, at least.

The PS3 plays PS1 games but not PS2 (early versions of PS3 played both) do people cry? Yes, a lot. But with good reason, because if it plays PS1, why not PS2?

Anyway, just wondering what you all think.

I saw the poll on GameFAQs and realized I was in the extreme minority (as I usually am in their polls) so I figured I'd start a discussion on SFO.

My answer? I don't care one bit about backwards compatibility. It's cool to have but I don't care at all if they don't want to put it in.

It also makes the system cost more, so I really don't care.

http://www.gamefaqs.com/poll/index.html?poll=4764

[RougetheBat4Real]

I think somebody is in love, with the Wii U. WHO CARES IF IT CAN't PLAY GAMECUBE GAMES? Oh, sure.

Defend that thing like it's your lover, sure it won't wash the dishes, or clean the dog, but you've got yourself a covenant with the almighty conduit, the Wii U. So who gives a moat about anything? As long as you have that Wii U your life will be complete.

[sroberson]

I'm of the belief that they should at least start to sell ALL of their games via digital media to be used on the consoles. It costs them almost nothing to create a seamless emulator built into the console and they (I will use general pronouns to refer to game companies) get to make money off of selling the games that were already created. It doesn't cost them anything to print the actual game disks, all it costs them is space on a server and accessibility to users. I mean we are seeing 3rd party SNES consoles being created and sold on the market by Yobo, we know the demand exists.

As far as people complaining more than they have in the past about backwards compatibility (you gave the example of Gamecube vs Wii basically so i'll stick with Nintendo) its because the games now just plain suck. We want the old games to consume because they were good and invoke nostalgia. Another factor to consider is the accessibility of video games to people. As it becomes more and more integrated into one's "coming of age" they will forever wish to be able to replay the games that they had when they were younger, just because.

[RougetheBat4Real]

Let me ask you this, smartass, If the games back then were so much better then why were you moping earlier about people who throw f-bombs at the Wii U for not being able to play gamecube games? Now you're saying they're right?

Be more consistent. I for one think that Nintendo should still be makin' Ice Climber sequels. Sell gamecube games on their home systems? It's too early for that. Even though gamecube is long gone, it's not exactly an NES, nor is it on par with one. When the gamecube games become classic is the day pigs fly. I'm just expressing myself, bucko. The only thing "backwards" is your inability to see your errors. Don't like it? Post in a different topic.

[sroberson]

Let me ask you this, smartass, If the games back then were so much better then why were you moping earlier about people who throw f-bombs at the Wii U for not being able to play gamecube games? Now you're saying they're right?

Be more consistent. I for one think that Nintendo should still be makin' Ice Climber sequels. Sell gamecube games on their home systems? It's too early for that. Even though gamecube is long gone, it's not exactly an NES, nor is it on par with one. When the gamecube games become classic is the day pigs fly. I'm just expressing myself, bucko.

Don't like it? Post in a different topic.

The fuck are you talking about? I don't even really know where to start on how confusing and randomly abrasive this post is. I'm regretting ever defending your existence in this forum from Redeemer

[RougetheBat4Real]

The fuck are you talking about? I don't even really know where to start on how confusing and randomly abrasive this post is. I'm regretting ever defending your existence in this forum from Redeemer

I'm sorry. Really, I am. I just had a really rough day, Eggman fired me.

In fact, I'm gonna give you some credits to make up for being mean.

[Krock]

People are angry about it because if the system can play Wii games it SHOULD be able to play GamCube games, and it CAN. By the way, your analogy on the GCN not playing N64 games is an invalid argument for the obvious fact that N64 games are cartridges, so that would impossible. Not to mention that people on the internet will find anything to bitch about, and the GameFAQs community is one of the most idiotic and ignorant communities that the internet has to offer.

Also, the Wii U isn't looking too hot, so you probably shouldn't be going fanboy over a system that we know minimal information about.

[RougetheBat4Real]

Also, the Wii U isn't looking too hot, so you probably shouldn't be going fanboy over a system that we know minimal information about.

See? Someone agrees with me. That guy was just blindly defending the Wii U. For all we know it could be some type of Eggman spying device. And...the wii u isn't looking too hot? Tell me a console that looks "hot" to you.

[Icy]

Oh wow, did you even get what I was saying? I'm not in love with the Wii U lol. Man you guys know how to blow stuff out of proportion. I was just starting a discussion on what SFO's members' views on backwards compatibility are. That's all. :)

[DoctorAllosaurus]

I like backwards compatability, I have alot of consoles, so being able to condense the shitty modern ones down to one dedicated console is a godsend. So now my set up is going to be PC, Wii U (Don't really want one but who the hell am I kidding, I'll end up getting one anyway), PS3, Gamecube, N64, Sega Genesis, Super Nintendo, Turbografx 16, NES, Atari 2600, and the Intellivision with voice module.

[sroberson]

My concern with not having backwards compatibility isn't so much having to stockpile the game consoles in order to play the older games, its the fact that hardware breaks eventually. Working in IT, I have learned to never trust computers to run for 'X' amount of time and take the general assumption that computer actually WANT to break. If I were to fast forward 15 years ahead and all of a sudden my Gamecube broke, I am probably a bit out of luck if I want to play Star Fox Adventures. I don't mind if it doesn't have the physical capacity to plug cartridges into the system like the Gamecube abandoned (even though I see a possible niche in going back to cartridge style systems due to the speed and cost effectiveness now), but we are seeing a day and age where digital media is very much a thriving market and the old classics as well as others could easily survive there - but it doesn't look like Nintendo is really into that idea just yet.

[CrypticQuery]

Let me ask you this, smartass, If the games back then were so much better then why were you moping earlier about people who throw f-bombs at the Wii U for not being able to play gamecube games? Now you're saying they're right?

Be more consistent. I for one think that Nintendo should still be makin' Ice Climber sequels. Sell gamecube games on their home systems? It's too early for that. Even though gamecube is long gone, it's not exactly an NES, nor is it on par with one. When the gamecube games become classic is the day pigs fly. I'm just expressing myself, bucko. The only thing "backwards" is your inability to see your errors. Don't like it? Post in a different topic.

Seriously, stop acting like a complete fool; there was no need for baseless insults regardless of how you feel on his opinion.

-------

Backwards compatibility is always a feature that I'm happy to see; while it is seemingly becoming harder to execute, it is always appreciated if the last generation had fantastic games.

[Fana McCloud]

Backwards compatibility within reason is a must for me - it's part of why contemporary consoles piss me off by performing a bait and switch by supporting some old games but not others. Of course I know why they don't bother being consistent in supporting older physical media, they want to re-sell me digital copies of the same exact thing for a new console, or have the option to in the future. Bonus points in the douchebaggery department if they bind your games to a console and not a portable account so that you have to re-re-buy them when console X comes out. Considering that they do everything in their power to make consoles LESS convenient an option for me, that's why I do primarily PC gaming these days. If a game is so old that my PC doesn't natively support it, chances are there's an emulator for it. Nuff said.

[Ellanie]

Nintendo is actually starting to embrace the digital side. We'll even soon be able to purchase 3DS games digitally only, and ALLEGEDLY we'll be able to get GCN games on the WiiU, but nothing official on that, it's just rumor.

On the subject at hand, yes. I think current consoles need backwards compatibility to make it, in whatever form that makes sense for the system, whether that means it can read old disks or be downloadable.

Obviously, it makes sense that N64 cartridges wouldn't run on a Gamecube, which used disks, but that was years ago. With the market these days, having the option of the older library is a pretty big selling point, since older games are cheaper, and nostalgia always helps. Also during the first year or two of a console, games are still coming out for the previous generation, so there is less to discourage a consumer from stepping up.

The fact that the WiiU is compatible with everything Wii related, from controllers to DLC, doesn't hurt a consumer's wallet, either.

I have a newer kind of PS3, so no PS2 games except the pathetic selection of DLC. (BloodRayne? Seriously? Why is that there?) However, I went with the newer one anyway for the massive selection of old PS1 games, as only about four or five PS3 games have enticed me, so there you go.

Fana McCloud, the WiiU is actually going to allow people to transfer everything they have on their Wii to a new WiiU, from save files to games. It'll be the first to do it all in digital format as well as hard copies. That's pretty much the only reason I'm comfortable with the idea of getting a WiiU.

[Sideways]

Honestly, It doesn't bother me that much that the Wii U won't play GCN games. I rarely play GCN anymore anyhow, let alone my Wii. My PS3 is one of the lucky ones that can play PS2 games and it's one of the sole reasons I bought the system. I'm not gonna keep a PS2 and a PS3 hooked up, when my PS3 can do both. Saves me the space in my very limited entertainment center that can be used for another system.

[Krock]

And...the wii u isn't looking too hot? Tell me a console that looks "hot" to you.

I'm not attracted to consoles! Geez, I meant "hot" in a way that the system and its software is not impressing me to buy one.

... Ah, who am I kidding? Donkey Kong Land 2 did some amazing things under the covers.

[Star Fox Runner]

I was a little sad when I saw that the Wii U wouldn't support GameCube games anymore, it's my favorite console, has some of my favorite games, and it had what was probably the most comfortable controller ever created.

But in reality it's not that surprising, the GameCube was two console generations ago, and seeing how most companies can make a killing by reselling older games as digital downloads, they'll just do that. A business needs to make money!

But it's not too much of a big deal for me, I still have my GameCube with GameBoy Player, and I'm gonna keep my Wii for nostalgia purposes, so I'll have plenty of ways to play, and if somehow they both break, I can always give the Dolphin Emulator a whirl. (Then I can play the games in HD)

So in reality, it's kinda sad, but no biggie.

[Ellanie]

I think that we, as the potetial customers and as a fandom, should put the bug in Nintendo's ear to make as many GC games as possible available of the WiiU's Virtual Console. We get great old GC games, and Nintendo makes money. While it would suck to buy a game twice, it would be the best solution for Nintendo.

[Peter]

I might be screaming like the weird old dude that lives down the block, but, IT'S A CONSPIRACY! I'TS JUST A MONEY-MAKING SCHEME!

The reason game companies aren't offering as much backward compatibility anymore is so they can offer it digitally to us, and we have to buy it again to play it on the newest system. Just another way to make money. Now, I'm not denouncing it and saying it's wrong (even though it is) it's good capitalism. No matter how jerky of them it is to do stuff like that, it's a way to make money, and so it's fair in our capitalist society.

[Ellanie]

Well, which do you prefer; spending a considerably larger amount of money on a system that can handle the many different formats, or spend a few bucks here and there on the games you like the most to be emulated?

I actually prefer the later, mostly because I don't care about but a few games from each generation, and would rather spend $50 to have them digital that $200+ to have a system with the hardware to read games from 5 different consoles.

[Fana McCloud]

Well, which do you prefer; spending a considerably larger amount of money on a system that can handle the many different formats, or spend a few bucks here and there on the games you like the most to be emulated?

I actually prefer the later, mostly because I don't care about but a few games from each generation, and would rather spend $50 to have them digital that $200+ to have a system with the hardware to read games from 5 different consoles.

There's always some kind of format that a proprietary console won't read that a computer can due to the ingenuity of programmers. I choose flexibility at added cost - I already need a computer to do all the normal things like web browsing, Skype, word processing, and the like, so spending a bit more when I go to upgrade so that it can play and emulate games isn't a huge trade-off for me. Consoles are limited by what an individual company dictates it will be capable of, whereas computers are infinitely expandable as I discover new needs. Until a console acts like that, it's just a severely crippled computer that can't be upgraded to me. Even offering "select" older titles as digital downloads doesn't jive with me because it's still a walled garden that has some huge limits on what you can get.

Also, consoles DO cost $200+ usually even in their current "I can only read current gen stuff" state, which is also part of my beef with consoles, as once upon a time I'm pretty sure they were made to be CHEAPER than buying a computer, but I can get a reasonable computer for like $300 which is around what these consoles sell for at launch - there's very little value to buying a console for gaming now other than exclusivity of certain titles. When consoles were much cheaper than computers, it was obvious why you would get them over a computer, but now the value is far more unclear.

[StarFoxfan-FUR_ever]

*Applauds* Fana, that was absolutely brilliant what you just stated. The main reason I have stuck to consoles is because of the exclusive titles. Now that I think of it, if you take a look at the 90's and 80's, the PC also offered a wide variety of media not available for the console, and was (and of course, still is) more powerful in terms of its processing speeds, graphic cards, and memory capacities.

Granted, I was never overwhelmed by the graphics of any video game, so I never jumped on the Xbox bandwagon when it "looked cool". Aside from that, part of the reason i have always stuck to Nintendo completely until very recently, was the nostalgia factor. If I were to start playing games on the PC, (I thought to myself) then I would miss out on all the fun little mario games and any of those other games I could enjoy playing with other people, which was another selling point, because since i was a little kid, I thought it to be a nuisance to wait almost an hour to turn on the computer in the first place, and so the console looked much more convienient in that sence as well.

So fastforward a bit, now we see how the handheld console starts bringing in huge sales to companies. Children no longer had to look out the window of the back seat of a car with a blank stare or nearly falling asleep at the mall when they were dragged along. Sure, these games werent always as fun as the console games, since they lacked content and the controls were extremely limited, but that didnt matter. (If anything, the most money I spent on handhelds was on the batteries I needed to turn the system on LOL )

Even more interesting, Nintendo was basically the only company that entered the handheld market, making their product truly exclusive. So we look at the GB Color and the GB advance, and both these systems feature said backwards compatibility. Interestingly enough, I recall my first time playing a GB color. Previously I had only experienced games like Pokemon Pinball in black and white on the GB Pocket. I was completely blown away by how much more detailed the game looked just by giving the sprites various colors. I did not expect such a huge jump in detail. (So i guess i take back my statement from before that graphics never played a role in purchasing a video game)

Back to the point I was trying to make. Ok so, this concept of backwards compatibility was brought about on the console/handheld side with the innovations of the GB series of handhelds. On the GB Advance, Nintendo added a nice feature. They decided not only to let you play your GB Color games on the new system, they would give you the option to stretch the screen to fit the Advance handheld resolution. Thinking back, even I realize the importance of how that showed that we can make old games look refined on a new console.

In the meantime, I finally had my own computer, which helped make things more convenient for my parents as well, since we didnt all have to share one together. I started getting games on the PC, since they were not available to me on the console, such as a few sports titles and racing games not featured on the GC. Being inexperienced with the keyboard, I found it very difficult getting used to for gaming. Eventually, I would get a gamepad which helped me out quite a bit. Eventually my PC would die completely, and when it came time to reinstalling some of these games into the new PC, they were simply not compatible, or the coding would be read incorrectly by the PC...though it was funny being stuck at low speeds in racing games...but saddening nontheless. I found that my consoles all worked fine for the most part, and I guess i lost interest in PC gaming because of the new expenses that would rise with games like WoW....(Seriously, I am NOT paying each month for that game, what a ripoff). Sorry if i offended anyone there...

So here I am with all but one console working currently, and so I start the whole emulator thing...yada yada yada, and I find that a lot of the games from the past really were complete garbage with stiff character movement. Granted, there are lots of wonderful classics, but beyond those, I start seeing how overrated many of these classic consoles were. The video game industry was never truly able to make every gamer happy or make the best of each genre of game. What I know for sure is that the early 90's was a time for major improvements in overall gaming capability, while the mid-late 90's was a huge step forward for platformers as well as an astonishing step forward for the graphical interface of games. The early 2000's was the best time period for games with a huge push in RPG games and a much more realistic look at sports titles and racing simulators. Actually, pretty much everything was going strong, though platforming started to wane a bit. The rest of the 2000's up until the present was were we see for the first time online gaming and the online gaming communities that formed as a result. However, the current issue stands as to whether or not the backward compatibility feature should continue. I don't see why it shouldn't. However, companies are trying to make money and thats...well....the hard truth.