Pokemon: Generation VI

[Vy'drach]

Explain Mr. Mime, Jynx, and the Nidoran lines then (really, please explain how you get Poison/Ground out of those appearances please). And those aren't the only ones, like the Exeggcute line having a Psychic typing for no real reason.

 

Mr. Mime and Jynx are acceptable designs for psychic, and the Nidoran line looks fine for being poison. There's no clear cut idea of what that'd look like before you run into them, but their design does make sense for that part of their type. Jynx's ice and the later evolutions of the Nidoran line's ground are surprises, but the poison part is not. Granted Exeggcute itself isn't so clear cut (though it does make sense actually due to the idea of eggplant, or that Bird's Nest Fungus), but Exeggutor is clearly a grass type pokemon from the get go. But their designs do make sense for at least one of their typings. But Stunfisk has no indicators what-so-ever to his typing. There is 0 indication that it would be a ground/electric pokemon until you find out from other sources.

 

Sudowoodo and Bonsly are another pair, being randomly rock pokemon, Pineco being a bug. Hippopotas and Hippowdon's only indicator that its ground is colouration, otherwise hippos are largely aquatic. The Solosis line just doesn't make any sense for anything, really, I guess psychic is the most sensible in a very loose use of that word. Axew's line seems odd to be a dragon type. 

 

Not saying Gen I designs were perfect for that, but there is a nonlinear increase in "What?" compared to the increase in pokemon as the generations went on.

[Thomas Draco]

Mr. Mime and Jynx are acceptable designs for psychic, and the Nidoran line looks fine for being poison.

Not the point I was making

 

There's no clear cut idea of what that'd look like before you run into them

That's the point I'm making, since it's the same as Stunfisk's situation.

 

but their design does make sense for that part of their type.

And you miss the point, again.

 

But Stunfisk has no indicators what-so-ever to his typing.

Like the others I've pointed out.

 

There is 0 indication that it would be a ground/electric pokemon until you find out from other sources.

Besides actually fighting it in battle and figuring it out from how your moves hit?

 

Sudowoodo and Bonsly are another pair, being randomly rock pokemon,

Sudowoodo

Pseudo wood

False, petrified wood, which is a real thing.

 

Pineco being a bug.

It's a bagworm that looks like a pine cone.

 

Hippopotas and Hippowdon's only indicator that its ground is colouration, otherwise hippos are largely aquatic.

And the fact that they live in a desert area.

 

And since when does the original animal's characteristics matter in Pokemon? Bunnies aren't poisonous (Nidoran), and ducks, starfish, eggplants don't typically exhibit psychic abilities either.

 

The Solosis line just doesn't make any sense for anything, really

Axew's line seems odd to be a dragon type.

Who cares, it's Pokemon! Pocket Monsters!

Oh come on, Axew evolves into a menacing, axe-faced, dragon. How is that odd for a Dragon-type?

 

Not saying Gen I designs were perfect for that, but there is a nonlinear increase in "What?" compared to the increase in pokemon as the generations went on.

No there hasn't. You're taking one example and touting it as "IT'S OVER POKEMON IS FINISHED".

[Geo Stelar]

No there hasn't. You're taking one example and touting it as "IT'S OVER POKEMON IS FINISHED".

 

Vydrach's merely pointing out that he hated the type issue with Stunfisk

 

Anyways, one more video, this time regarding Mew Two and Sylveon

 

[Thomas Draco]

Vydrach's merely pointing out that he hated the type issue with Stunfisk

There isn't an Isshu (geddit) though.

[Drasiana]

Stunfisk is based on a type of fish that makes a point of burying itself in the mud so no the ground typing actually makes a lot of sense.

 

The only generation I didn't really like was IV, where everything just looked overdesigned and they totally overdid it with the legendaries, but there's a lot of rose-tinted glasses in the whole "waaah pokemon is ruined 5ever" sentiments

[Thomas Draco]

where everything just looked overdesigned and they totally overdid it with the legendaries

The hell does overdesigned even mean? How can you over design something? Just say you don't like them, and don't spout words that don't make sense.

[Xortberg]

The hell does overdesigned even mean? How can you over design something? Just say you don't like them, and don't spout words that don't make sense.

 

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/overdesign

 

If you're going to try and be all snarky and superior, maybe you shouldn't ask questions when the answers are literally only a Google search away. Claiming something - like, say, a Pokemon - is overdesigned is a perfectly valid argument if you can back it up, and it does make sense.

 

Note that I'm not commenting on the design of any Pokemon. I don't have any strong feelings either way about any particular gen's designs. Just pointing out that you're pretty much being a colossal dick here.

[Thomas Draco]

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/overdesign

 

If you're going to try and be all snarky and superior, maybe you shouldn't ask questions when the answers are literally only a Google search away. Claiming something - like, say, a Pokemon - is overdesigned is a perfectly valid argument if you can back it up, and it does make sense.

I already know it's a word, that doesn't mean it isn't pointless to use it. What makes anybody the judge of what's overdesigned or not, then? What's underdesigned? What causes a design to be overdesigned? How can a design be overdesigned if it's a completely subjective matter of thinking?

[Geo Stelar]

I think pokemon being over- or under-designed is usually subjective. For me, pokemon designs are either plain and simple like the starters,  or just unique like the legendaries.

[Drasiana]

Wow fan the flames on your fanny there son I'm sorry for using a word that you'd rather not exist for the sake of your rampant fanaticism in defending the honour of goddamn Pokemon.

 

By "overdesigned" I mean I felt a lot of the Pokemon in Generation IV had a whole ton of extra bits and patterns that really didn't need to be there and made a lot of them look like a whole lot of nothing. Frosslass, Giratina, and the Burmy evolution line are all examples of this. Simpler designs would've benefited the lot of them. And when people "just don't like something" there's usually a reason for that, you dolt. My reason for "just not liking them" is that they're overdesigned. You can like them for the same reason and I never said anything to suggest otherwise, but that is exactly the reason I have identified for why I dislike them.

 

Get over yourself. My post literally said that Pokemon wasn't "ruined forever" just because you don't like some modern designs anyway.

[Thomas Draco]

Wow fan the flames on your fanny there son I'm sorry for using a word that you'd rather not exist for the sake of your rampant fanaticism in defending the honour of goddamn Pokemon.

Or, you know, I just like calling out things that don't make sense.

By "overdesigned" I mean I felt a lot of the Pokemon in Generation IV had a whole ton of extra bits and patterns that really didn't need to be there and made a lot of them look like a whole lot of nothing.

What do you mean a whole lot of nothing? If it's so "overdesigned" with a "whole ton of extra bits and patterns" then how is it nothing? Not to mention that saying that you think there's extra bits and patterns is still a subjective point of view and doesn't mean something is overdesigned.

Frosslass, Giratina, and the Burmy evolution line are all examples of this.

lol what? All three of those examples are pretty simplistic. Hell, Gyarados has more lines and markings on its body than Giratina.

Simpler designs would've benefited the lot of them.

How "simple"? You want them to become one color, bland, amorphous blobs or what?

And when people "just don't like something" there's usually a reason for that, you dolt.

And unfortunately for you, your reason doesn't make sense.

Get over yourself. My post literally said that Pokemon wasn't "ruined forever" just because you don't like some modern designs anyway.

Great, doesn't make your reasons for not liking them less nonsensical.

[Drasiana]

Are you seriously picking a fight with me over the fact that I just plain don't like the designs of some Pokemon because I think their designs are too busy? Really? Do you honestly have nothing better to do? Do you have anything else to contribute to this topic other than screeching about 4Chan drama or whining because other people like different things than you, telling me that real words don't exist and clearly misunderstanding what "subjective" means? Despite the fact that I've made it clear that this is my opinion, yet here you are screeching on about how my opinion is wrong because it's an opinion? What the fuck is wrong with you?

 

But anyways, because you apparently don't understand anything anyone is saying here despite thinking that you're smarter than everyone else:

 

 

This is Pikachu, also known as "one of the most famous cartoon and gaming characters of all time". He's a staple for the series and even people who've never touched a Pokemon game knows who he is. Why? Because Pikachu has a simple, elegant design that manages to be both cute and clever. His body is simple, a basic rodent-thing shape, but it's his lightning-bolt shaped tail and red cheeks that make him stand out. They're sensible additions to his design, as it makes sense for a cute animal to have cute cheeks and a tail, but they both serve a function in Pikachu's abilities and typing, and give him a unique flair.

 

This is Frosslass.

 

 

Frosslass is a head with arms coming out of them and horns made of ice and its body is some amorphous foot blob with a bow on it. Some people think it's cool and that's okay, but I can't really parse what's going on here. What is this thing supposed to be? Why? It just looks like a random mess of parts stuck together and it took me several encounters in the game plus some further reading to even really figure out what I was looking at.

 

Next, I don't just "think" there's extra bits and patterns. That's not how that works. There ARE.

 

For example, again. Gyarados and Giratina, which you think are mildly comparable for some fucking reason:

 

 

Gyarados is a really big catfish. He has a big mouth, whiskers, a long segmented body, fins, and a tail with a simple blue/yellow colour pattern.

 

 

Giratina is a...um. Totally Goffick Dinosaur? He has a tiny head on a really long, thick neck covered in yellow...things. The same yellow things cover all six of his stumpy legs. There are some red things this time attached to his, uh, shadow wings that are evidently attached to his neck for some reason. He as another form, though, which is

 

 

what the fuck

 

Do you not see this? Giratina is just covered in random yellow and red bullshit. There doesn't seem to be any function to its form, it's just something flashy to wave at people who think WOW TOTALLY HARDCORE BECAUSE SPIKES AND SHIT even if those spikes and shit aren't really there for any discernible reason. The stupid feet-turned-side-spike things just look tacked on, they aren't even streamlined into the colour pattern and both designs are really bottom-heavy because the wings are attached in a place that doesn't really make anatomical sense, even by Pokemon standards.

 

Pikachu and Gyarados' designs are simplistic in that everything on them is functional, yet remains interesting. Giratina and Frosslass are not functional, they are weird random bits thrown together.

 

Now, you can keep barfing out words like "nonsensical" and "subjective" and not seeing the conflict there while smearing your baby food around the topic but seriously dude

 

This is why I don't like a lot of these designs.

 

I honestly couldn't give less of a shit if you do or don't

 

But this is my reasoning as to why I, myself, do not like them, and if you still become so red-hot enraged in complete incomprehension that someone else is not attracted to the same design cues as you then my only real advice for you is to drop it and move the fuck on with your life

 

edit:

 

Oh, and because this is a "Pokemon Generation VI" topic and not a "SFO users whine about other generations" topic, apparently Nintendo is hosting a special 90-minute presentation on X/Y at E3 beginning at 6pm PST on June 11th. The president of the Pokemon company is apparently going to be a part of it so theoretically this is going to be an interesting showcase.

 

edit 2: will edit in the morning I wrote this after drinking like a litre of booze what what

[Redeemer]

Or, you know, I just like calling out things that don't make sense.

 

 

 

My Grumpy Sylveon says:

 

Overdesigned: "Designed to be excessively complicated or to an excessive degree of capability and durability."

>excessively complicated

>to an excessive degree

>excessive = more than is needed

>was the point being made

>appropriate word use

 

Quit being a douche and insulting people just because you don't understand them. If you can't stand up to reasoning, don't retaliate with snarkyness. Now quit it.

[Geo Stelar]

apparently Nintendo is hosting a special 90-minute presentation on X/Y at E3 beginning at 6pm PST on June 11th. The president of the Pokemon company is apparently going to be a part of it so theoretically this is going to be an interesting showcase.

 

I'm so excited for this. and 90 minutes!! wow. I hope we'll see some new spoilers, if ever.

[Thomas Draco]

Are you seriously picking a fight with me over the fact that I just plain don't like the designs of some Pokemon because I think their designs are too busy? Really? Do you honestly have nothing better to do? Do you have anything else to contribute to this topic other than screeching about 4Chan drama or whining because other people like different things than you, telling me that real words don't exist and clearly misunderstanding what "subjective" means? Despite the fact that I've made it clear that this is my opinion, yet here you are screeching on about how my opinion is wrong because it's an opinion? What the fuck is wrong with you?

A. I don't see how this is a fight

B. The hell does 4chan have to do with this?

C. I can disagree with your opinion if I want and tell you why I disagree with it.

 

This is Pikachu, also known as "one of the most famous cartoon and gaming characters of all time". He's a staple for the series and even people who've never touched a Pokemon game knows who he is. Why? Because Pikachu has a simple, elegant design that manages to be both cute and clever. His body is simple, a basic rodent-thing shape, but it's his lightning-bolt shaped tail and red cheeks that make him stand out. They're sensible additions to his design, as it makes sense for a cute animal to have cute cheeks and a tail, but they both serve a function in Pikachu's abilities and typing, and give him a unique flair.

Okay.

And Froslass is no different than Pikachu in the department of simplicity or design.

Really, one major color like Pikachu that gives away its primary type, some extra features that accentuate that type (Ice horns vs. Lightning tail), and some monster design characteristics like weird non-mouse-like ears on Pikachu and the head kimono arms on Froslass. Froslass is no more designed than Pikachu is, especially considering the backstory of its design and basis of it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuki-onna

 

Next, I don't just "think" there's extra bits and patterns. That's not how that works. There ARE.

Actually yes you do think because thinking there's extra bits and patters is an opinion.

 

For example, again. Gyarados and Giratina, which you think are mildly comparable for some fucking reason:

Gyarados is a really big catfish. He has a big mouth, whiskers, a long segmented body, fins, and a tail with a simple blue/yellow colour pattern.

Okay, now I'm pretty sure you've never seen a catfish before, because Gyarados isn't even close to one. Barbroach is closer to an actual catfish than Gyarados is.

 

Giratina is a...um. Totally Goffick Dinosaur? He has a tiny head on a really long, thick neck covered in yellow...things. The same yellow things cover all six of his stumpy legs. There are some red things this time attached to his, uh, shadow wings that are evidently attached to his neck for some reason.

I don't see the problem here. Those "yellow things" mesh well into the design and give a nice gilded look.

 

He as another form, though

 

Do you not see this? Giratina is just covered in random yellow and red bullshit. There doesn't seem to be any function to its form, it's just something flashy to wave at people who think WOW TOTALLY HARDCORE BECAUSE SPIKES AND SHIT even if those spikes and shit aren't really there for any discernible reason. The stupid feet-turned-side-spike things just look tacked on, they aren't even streamlined into the colour pattern and both designs are really bottom-heavy because the wings are attached in a place that doesn't really make anatomical sense, even by Pokemon standards.

Okay, you're complaining about things having function to its form, so how do you explain say Gyarados's crown? Also, complaining about "WOW TOTALLY HARDCORE, SPIKES, ETC." is pretty hypocritical because Gyarados, Nidoking, Rhydon, etc. could fall right in the same category, since the spikes on those Pokemon aren't there for any reason either. And complaining about the color pattern? Come on, both Gyarados and Giratina have a completely comparable color pattern and a reasonable one. Gyarados has white-yellow spots and a belly every segment, Giratina has a red and black stripe pattern down its body. They really aren't that different in design complexity.

Pikachu and Gyarados' designs are simplistic in that everything on them is functional, yet remains interesting.

And Froslass and Giratina do the same thing.

This is why I don't like a lot of these designs.

 

I honestly couldn't give less of a shit if you do or don't

Good, and you don't have to give a shit.

 

But this is my reasoning as to why I, myself, do not like them, and if you still become so red-hot enraged in complete incomprehension that someone else is not attracted to the same design cues as you then my only real advice for you is to drop it and move the fuck on with your life

I'm the one red-hot enraged? I've remained calm this entire time, but fine, I'll move on.

Nintendo is hosting a special 90-minute presentation on X/Y at E3 beginning at 6pm PST on June 11th. The president of the Pokemon company is apparently going to be a part of it so theoretically this is going to be an interesting showcase.

GET HYPE

[Vy'drach]

Alright you two, I'm sayin' this as a precaution. Discussing differing opinions is fine, but don't get too hot under the collar and start insulting each other and what not. That's when a good debate starts being a flamewar or such, and stops being ok.

[Drasiana]

Red that Sylveon is perfect. My face when people hate on fairy type, dang it.

 

Though I might still prefer a sound type in the realm of new-type speculation, but I'm biased.

 

Now, TD:

 

Lots of words that I don't give a shit about

 

I really don't know why you continue to whine about how my opinion is an opinion because we've made that clear, but you really, really don't want to shut up, do you? I'm done, feel free to continue to spin in impotent circles about the fact that I think Giratina, Frosslass, and the bulk of Gen IV are overdesigned garbage, because none of the opinions you're trying to present as facts will change mine.

[Redeemer]

Red that Sylveon is perfect. My face when people hate on fairy type, dang it.

 

I snort-giggled all the way through drawing it. I'll just tell people he's like, Sylveon and Grumpy Cat's lovechild.

[Drasiana]

When I get a Sylveon I'm naming it Tardar Sauce, in your honour~

[Geo Stelar]

I'm actually thinking of putting up a poll here and vote for a new type that you like the best

[Vy'drach]

http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/06/11/e3-2013-pokemon-x-y-release-date-announced

 

 

Fairy type confirmed, as well as actually caring for pokemon and petting them.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ziue9ePsnKM

Edited June 11, 2013 by Vydrach

[Thomas Draco]

ahahaha

 

FUCK

 

I'll get over the Fairy soon, but why did Marill get Fariy'd?

[Xortberg]

Fairy type isn't happening, and all rumors saying it is are unsubstantiated.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H47ow4_Cmk0

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrjwaqZfjIY

 

 

Douchiness aside, this means that Dragons finally have a counter that isn't Dragons and Poison might actually have a reason to exist.

 

Yes.

[Drasiana]

What's that about Fairy type?

 

 

anyway that Pokemon-Amie thing is cute and also hOLY FUCK THAT BAT WYVERN AND THE MOTH THING ARE AWESOME

[Xortberg]

 

Nothing has changed, really, and Dragon types aren't OP, they never have been. They've had 2 highly offensive counters and their defenses are usually below average. Not to mention most Dragon types are either Dragon/Flying or Dragon/Ground, which gives 4x weakness to Ice, which most Pokemon who orient with Sp. Atk can pack Ice Beam.

Currently in OU, the only Pokemon with Ice typing are Cloyster, Kyurem-B and Mamoswine. Of those three, using Kyurem as an anti-Dragon means that 6 of the 8 Dragon types in OU can outspeed him and Dragon his ass, so that really only leaves 2 OU anti-Dragons, and that's if Cloyster has a chance to set up with Shell Smash. In Uber, there's just Arceus and Kyurem-W as Ice types, as opposed to 9 different Dragons.

 

What counters Dragon? Ice and Dragon. With so few Ice in the higher tiers, you have to resort to Dragon to beat Dragon. Now, yes, you can argue that you could teach Alakazam an Ice move, but that does give up on STAB and another moveslot, so that's a whole nother argument for a different time.

 

I'm no expert on Pokemeta. In fact, I've only been following it for a couple of months, really, and only casually. But from what I see, it's generally a universal agreement that Dragons are really fucking strong, and having something to counter them is a pretty good thing.

 

Saying Fairy type somehow balances things (even though it was already balanced) is kinda silly considering what we've seen of the Fairy type: An Eeveelution, Gardevoir who has been UU for years, the Jigglypuff line, and Marill. None of those pose a threat to Dragon types really at this point.

 

An Eeveelution whose stats and movepool we don't know yet (and considering OU already houses 3 Eeveelutions, discounting Sylveon just for that reason is uttely silly), Gardevoir whose new moves, resistances, and super-effectives might very well change her place in the meta (and from what I've heard, drastic meta-shifts are uncommon, but not impossible) and Azumarill, with a possible Huge Power physical Fairy move to do some serious damage to Dragon threats.

 

And again, as Dras said, THOSE FOUR SURE ARE GOING TO BE THE ONLY FAIRY TYPES YEPYEP.

 

Tl;dr, Fairy type is boss, most people seem to agree that having a Dragon counter is cool beans, and you're being a dick