Gameplay and the price for it.

[OlcanBishop]

I'm not sure if this has been talked about before.

 

I've been meaning to find the words on how to bring up this topic and I may or may not have found the words for it. Do you Star Fox needs to be reinvented? As a big Star Fox fan myself and played all of them and enjoyed some parts of it and some parts i didn't, do you think the traditional gameplay (the on-rails segments) justify the price of the game itself?  By design it is fun despite being a bit limited. And I know Miyamoto did say that he is bringing more experimental gameplay in this new installment. 

Let's think for a moment. Back in the old days (made me feel freakin' old) back in 1993, the SNES Star Fox has been released. Only 3 routes available but it was a great game of its time and for the right price. 
 

Star Fox 64 came out several years later. Multiple ways to play the game with two endings and a great multiplayer of its time. And still the price was right for it's time.

 

Now, with the way things are today in the gaming industry and especially how large the games these days are, do you think traditional gameplay justify a $59.99 (plus tax) price tag? It is far too early to tell of course, for all we know, with the old game mechanic would surprise us with a new twist. I just hope with these experimental gameplay, it would breath new life into the series and could take it into a new direction.

 

Now, another thing came into mind. Miyamoto referenced Thunderbird's a lot, despite the puppet cast is a nice idea, in fact it could be fun to watch it that way. But, what if Mr.Miyamoto referenced Thunderbird's in a way that the story could be structured as an episode of the TV series. Could mean anything. I welcome the idea of a reboot. So let's see how things go. 

[Drasiana]

It is far too early to tell of course, for all we know, with the old game mechanic would surprise us with a new twist.

 

But... we do know. New things being introduced by this game:

 

-Co-op modes

-Arwingcopter

-Arwing-to-Landmaster transformations

-Potential episodic format (which potentially means it won't be $60)

 

And that's from the small handful of details we got at E3.

 

A game being fun and rewarding always justifies the price for me.

[Dr. Orange]

If fun, then buy.

If not fun, then return.

The Zigershnikel Equation.

 

On the same topic I don't think games like Cal o' Doodie are worth the prices they put out for it. Yet, depending on the game and the amount of money put into and what can be gotten out of from fans, I would sell games at $60 bucks just knowing you all would buy it. 

[OlcanBishop]

Hmm...I came to the conclusion that this may not have been the right topic to talk about. With the details provided, I'm beginning to think that this may be a downloadable.  

[DZComposer]

No way this is just a small E-Shop title. They made too big of a deal about it for that.

But really, it is just too early to make any kind of judgements. What was at E3 was nothing more than a proof-of-concept build.

[Joseph.]

No way this is just a small E-Shop title. They made too big of a deal about it for that.

But really, it is just too early to make any kind of judgements. What was at E3 was nothing more than a proof-of-concept build.

 

I want to agree with you but Nintendo just said they'll release Star Fox before the new Zelda... In other words, a console game takes more then a year to produce while Eshop games take less. Here we have a Star Fox(Proof-of-Concept) shown  during E3 and now they're going to release it early in 2015 before the new Zelda comes out (Which has been in work  long before) I know they've been working on Star Fox for the Wii but it looks like they scraped it and started all over because that demo didn't look far in progress. 

 

[Pharaoh Shadon]

Well I don't think that a starfox game would take as long to make as a zelda game.

 

In zelda, you need to be creative. Think of puzzles, map out dungeons, make locations make sense, map out how you are going to block people from accessing points and make sure you have a way to get them there later on, there is sooooooooo much to consider.

 

In starfox, you make a rail shooter with perhaps a few branching paths, and make a fancy background.

[Joseph.]

Well I don't think that a starfox game would take as long to make as a zelda game.

 

In zelda, you need to be creative. Think of puzzles, map out dungeons, make locations make sense, map out how you are going to block people from accessing points and make sure you have a way to get them there later on, there is sooooooooo much to consider.

 

In starfox, you make a rail shooter with perhaps a few branching paths, and make a fancy background.

 

 

 

Star Fox Assault was being made by Namco since 2003 and eventually came out during 2005...What were the results? A very short game with an unbalence Multiplayer and many other flaws

 

 

Here we have Nintendo showcasing Star Fox U (early build) during E3. That was just a couple of months ago and they all ready gave us an idea of what the release date might be. (Sometime Before Zelda U/2015)

Thats not even a Year and a half of development. It sounds to me SFU will be a Downloadable title

[Pharaoh Shadon]

Star Fox Assault was being made by Namco since 2003 and eventually came out on 2005...What were the results? A very short game with an unbalence Multiplayer and many other flaws

 

It also had full 3D maps, several different kinds of enemy AI, many gameplay styles, and weapon types, map, and objective planning, fusing in air, landmaster, and ground game styles into one single level, and as you said, a multiplayer mode that incorporates all of that.

 

And even so, this isn't 2003 anymore, with new engines and styles, games can be made allot quicker now, especially a rail shooter, something that fans and average people are making by themself in a timely matter. (In fact, someone on the forum is making this pretty nice looking starfox game, Solo I think, an entire team of Nintendo employees shouldn't have a problem with this assuming it's strictly a N64 style game)

[Joseph.]

It also had full 3D maps, several different kinds of enemy AI, many gameplay styles, and weapon types, map, and objective planning, fusing in air, landmaster, and ground game styles into one single level, and as you said, a multiplayer mode that incorporates all of that.

 

And even so, this isn't 2003 anymore, with new engines and styles, games can be made allot quicker now, especially a rail shooter, something that fans and average people are making by themself in a timely matter. (In fact, someone on the forum is making this pretty nice looking starfox game, Solo I think, an entire team of Nintendo employees shouldn't have a problem with this assuming it's strictly a N64 style game)

 

 

As much as i like Assault...

 

-Most weapons were useless

1. -Maps were way to big for 4-player mode

-Controls were horrible (yes, even the Landmaster)

-AI was horrible 

 

Assaults my Favorite SF game but a Game that took 2 years to make should be better.

 

Also, yes its not 2003 anymore, its 2014 where games take millions of dollars to make unlike a couple of thousands it took dev's to make during the gamecube era.

 

 

And finally... 

Here we have Nintendo showcasing Star Fox U (early build) during E3. That was just a couple of months ago and they all ready gave us an idea of what the release date might be. (Sometime Before Zelda U/2015)

Thats not even a Year and a half of development. It sounds to me SFU will be a Downloadable title

[Pharaoh Shadon]

-Most weapons were useless (I say more situation, just wasn't much of a situation to use some of them) but were created non the less, and did take time.

 

- Sure the maps may have been way too big, but that still took time. And if it was too big, it means they took even more time per stage (And the multipalyer stages were just single player levels with the exception of a few if I remember right)

 

-Controls may have been bad (Although I found them rather good other than the land master. It's just that the control style wasn't as pleasant as one would like) but it still took time, testing, planning, and all that fun stuff to incorporate.

 

- AI may have been horrible, but still took time to make.

 

Assault is my favorite starfox game too (Barely above starfox 64 3D) but I do remember a bit of development hell. It was suppose to be an arcade and have allot more stuff, but then suddenly it was for gamecube, and suddenly there was no time/cut things from it and it had to be released without some of the things they wanted in it. My point wasn't that assault was good, my point was with everything in it, it took time to do, and the things in assault is MUCH more than what the next starfox game might have.

 

 

I'm just saying that the next starfox game isn't going to take very long to create because all they have to do is make a story (Which they've had YEARS to write) create a path, and create fancy backgrounds for those paths. The rest is enemy AI (Which may very well be recycled and improved from previous games) and graphics. Perhaps a few fun things here and there to improve gameplay/weapons but again, may very well be recycled and improved from previous titles.

[Joseph.]

-Most weapons were useless (I say more situation, just wasn't much of a situation to use some of them) but were created non the less, and did take time.

 

- Sure the maps may have been way too big, but that still took time. And if it was too big, it means they took even more time per stage (And the multipalyer stages were just single player levels with the exception of a few if I remember right)

 

-Controls may have been bad (Although I found them rather good other than the land master. It's just that the control style wasn't as pleasant as one would like) but it still took time, testing, planning, and all that fun stuff to incorporate.

 

- AI may have been horrible, but still took time to make.

 

Assault is my favorite starfox game too (Barely above starfox 64 3D) but I do remember a bit of development hell. It was suppose to be an arcade and have allot more stuff, but then suddenly it was for gamecube, and suddenly there was no time/cut things from it and it had to be released without some of the things they wanted in it. My point wasn't that assault was good, my point was with everything in it, it took time to do, and the things in assault is MUCH more than what the next starfox game might have.

 

 

I'm just saying that the next starfox game isn't going to take very long to create because all they have to do is make a story (Which they've had YEARS to write) create a path, and create fancy backgrounds for those paths. The rest is enemy AI (Which may very well be recycled and improved from previous games) and graphics. Perhaps a few fun things here and there to improve gameplay/weapons but again, may very well be recycled and improved from previous titles.

 

Im glad to see someone here is defending Assault :'D

and obviously a Zelda title takes longer to make then a Star Fox game but the amount of time it takes to create a console game during this era is 2 or more years. Its not just creating the game but you also have to market it and that takes time as well. 

 

Just look at Star Fox 64 3D. It was being worked on since 2010 and came out during 2012 and that was just a remake. A handheld remake....

 

We're talking about a brad new Star Fox title with original content for a console!!

[Pharaoh Shadon]

Im glad to see someone here is defending Assault :'D

and obviously a Zelda title takes longer to make then a Star Fox game but the amount of time it takes to create a console game during this era is 2 or more years. Its not just creating the game but you also have to market it and that takes time as well. 

 

Just look at Star Fox 64 3D. It was being worked on since 2010 and came out during 2012 and that was just a remake. A handheld remake....

 

We're talking about a brad new Star Fox title with original content for a console!!

 

If someone who defends assault is new to you, go to the last locked topic XD 

 

As for the star fox 64 3D... Good point. I can't argue against that TBH.

 

Nintendo is known for delaying game releases though. So they may say that, but the game may very well be delayed. Or they've been making this starfox game for a while now, and just used a prototype from a few years ago to show people it's being made, but not enough info on the real game, that way people won't judge/tear down the trailers or whatever before it's even released.

[Drasiana]

Why do topics keep circling back to Assault?? Anyway...

 

-The general engine and mechanics that SFU uses were created for a proposed Wii game. While that game was shelved because of the console's limitations, they carried over what they had developed for it into the WiiU version. The E3 build we saw was also apparently not indicative of the recent progress made on the game, but rather a random early build Miyamoto grabbed last minute for E3 (not a specially-prepared-and-fine-tuned demo like they usually are). So yeah though everything looks unpolished they've been focusing on the core game mechanics and are sort of further along than we thought.

 

-If they are doing episodic gameplay like Miyamoto said he wanted to do, the release date we're getting doesn't mean "ok there's your Star Fox bye" it means the first episode of Star Fox is out while they continue to work on the following episodes. We still don't really know what they're doing about the episodic thing, exactly, but it really wouldn't surprise me that they're going that way with such a quick release date yet little word on the game itself. 2015 is not far away.

[Pharaoh Shadon]

Why do topics keep circling back to Assault?? Anyway...

 

-The general engine and mechanics that SFU uses were created for a proposed Wii game. While that game was shelved because of the console's limitations, they carried over what they had developed for it into the WiiU version. The E3 build we saw was also apparently not indicative of the recent progress made on the game, but rather a random early build Miyamoto grabbed last minute for E3 (not a specially-prepared-and-fine-tuned demo like they usually are). So yeah though everything looks unpolished they've been focusing on the core game mechanics and are sort of further along than we thought.

 

-If they are doing episodic gameplay like Miyamoto said he wanted to do, the release date we're getting doesn't mean "ok there's your Star Fox bye" it means the first episode of Star Fox is out while they continue to work on the following episodes. We still don't really know what they're doing about the episodic thing, exactly, but it really wouldn't surprise me that they're going that way with such a quick release date yet little word on the game itself. 2015 is not far away.

 

O.O That episode style seems a bit interesting (Although being a sonic fan, scares me a bit due to sonic 4 EP 1 and 2)

 

That makes me wonder what it's gonna be like though. And it might bug me a bit, I mean if the games being released in episodes, it's gonna be like an hour per episode if they are doing a full game.

 

Although if it's in episodes and the full game ends up being HOURS long (Like lots of episodes/each episode actually pretty long) then I think I can accept that

[OlcanBishop]

And here I thought this topic was dead. While many of you did bring up a lot of good points here and there, I am still optimistic about it. For all we know this new Star Fox title could have been in development longer than they are willing to admit. Although, this is not Zelda of course. I am wagering at least four years total (counting the cancelled Star Fox Wii and two more years on the Wii U). 

 

If it where to be episodic releases, that could be a good idea in a way if they developed right. But, let us all wait until a Nintendo Direct show case what they got. But, for all we know we could be waiting until E3. 

[The VGM Lover]

 

But... we do know. New things being introduced by this game:

 

-Co-op modes

-Arwingcopter

-Arwing-to-Landmaster transformations

-Potential episodic format (which potentially means it won't be $60)

 

And that's from the small handful of details we got at E3.

 

A game being fun and rewarding always justifies the price for me.

​Let's not forget the ability to shoot in one direction while flying in another. I've never seen or heard of a flying shooter game with fighters that can do that.

[Jeroscope]

I will leave my response here succinctly:

I don't care about the story. I don't care about any characters outside Star Fox and Star Wolf from the N64. All I care is that the game is fun, the music is great, and that it becomes successful for once. I'll make my fanfics and my fan characters on the side, but at the core, Star Fox is about gameplay. That's what made the original so great.

That, and it's pretty clear that the game needs to stick to its Shinto roots, flying through arches, and being the fox guardian of prosperity. Because motherf***ing foxes.

[Setsuna]

if i recall this is what people wanted in the first place. good ol on rail shooting with all range mode thrown in for extra flavor. the walker transformation to me seems like its there for people who were quacking about fox's on foot missions. welp, here we have it. and a new vehicle to boot. the gyrowing. the landmaster being able to transform has me confused though.

[Terramax]

I'm wondering if this is going to be a similar case to Splatoon, where they'll release a bare-bones game to begin with, and then patch in new content at a later date, either for free, or at an extra price. This would be the only way forward if they're planning on making it a retail title.

 

This game is supposedly coming out before the Zelda title, and yet it appears to be in a less complete state. Unless they've a huge team working on it, even with the... minimalistic graphics (which I have NO problem with, I'll add), and linear gameplay, I'm struggling to see how they'll have a big game released within the year.