So you know what would be completely, insanely amazing?

[sniper]

a Star Fox MMORPG.....   

where you could get in your ship and fly to different planets while dogfighting people the whole way there.

you could walk around on planets (kinda like Metroid Prime 3)  with missions, and insane battles.....  I would probably die for something like that on wii

(p.s. sorry if there's already a thread kinda like this)

[Kursed]

question:can you play cannon characters? possibly Kursed?

[Steve]

Starfox taken seriously by game designers, that would be good.

[Andrew McCloud]

Starfox taken seriously by game designers, that would be good.

A-MEN.

[Guest Julius Quasar]

a Star Fox MMORPG.....   

where you could get in your ship and fly to different planets while dogfighting people the whole way there.

you could walk around on planets (kinda like Metroid Prime 3)  with missions, and insane battles.....  I would probably die for something like that on wii

(p.s. sorry if there's already a thread kinda like this)

not bad

Starfox taken seriously by game designers, that would be good.

totally

[Asper Sarnoff]

It would be cool indeed. Tough I'm not much of a fan of MMORPG, my internet is to slow to run them, and they always have a subscription fee.

I think this topic will be closed soon due to this thread.

"Next Star Fox discussion (Other threads will be locked)"

[Kursed]

It would be cool indeed. Tough I'm not much of a fan of MMORPG, my internet is to slow to run them, and they always have a subscription fee.

I think this topic will be closed soon due to this thread.

"Next Star Fox discussion (Other threads will be locked)"

no this is speculation about another game.

[Andrew McCloud]

o.O Isn't that what the thread is about?

[AlliedDan]

a Star Fox MMORPG.....   

where you could get in your ship and fly to different planets while dogfighting people the whole way there.

you could walk around on planets (kinda like Metroid Prime 3)  with missions, and insane battles.....  I would probably die for something like that on wii

(p.s. sorry if there's already a thread kinda like this)

I disagree.

[Beta Link]

a Star Fox MMORPG.....   

where you could get in your ship and fly to different planets while dogfighting people the whole way there.

you could walk around on planets (kinda like Metroid Prime 3)  with missions, and insane battles.....  I would probably die for something like that on wii

(p.s. sorry if there's already a thread kinda like this)

I actually really like parts of this idea. While I'm not that big a fan of MMORPGs, your concept of being able to freely travel across the Lylat System, and go to whatever planet you want, whenever you want, would be so incredibly awesome. Reminds me of traveling across Hyrule on horseback, and fighting enemies with the sword and bow along the way, in Zelda: Twilight Princess.

[DZComposer]

Time to pull out the 'ol form post again (type once, post anywhere ) :

I'm Sorry, _____Sniper_____, but Star Fox does not need anymore genre-shifts. Your idea of a Star Fox (Racing | RPG | MMO | FPS | Puzzle | Platformer | RTS | ____________ ) Game would further dillute a series that has already majorly suffered from a Genre-shift. Another one could totally destroy what little fanbase remains.

Star Fox is, and always should be, a 3D space shooter. People get into games like Star Fox because they like the type of game. Ever since the release of Star Fox Adventures, there has been a rift in the fanbase between those who want the series to follow SFAd, and those who want the series to stay what it has always been. This has not been good for the fandom, and the last thing we need is an influx of (Racing | RPG | MMO | FPS | Puzzle | Platformer | RTS | ____________ ) Game fans to further fracture the fanbase.

If Nintendo wanted to create a new Space (Racing | RPG | MMO | Adventure | FPS | Puzzle | Platformer | RTS | ____________ ) Game, they should either use an existing apropriate franchise, or start a new one.

[Andrew McCloud]

:P You mind if I borrow that format occasionally DZ? It may prove very useful in the future >.>

[rainfyre66]

Time to pull out the 'ol form post again (type once, post anywhere ) :

I'm Sorry, _____Sniper_____, but Star Fox does not need anymore genre-shifts. Your idea of a Star Fox (Racing | RPG | MMO | FPS | Puzzle | Platformer | RTS | ____________ ) Game would further dillute a series that has already majorly suffered from a Genre-shift. Another one could totally destroy what little fanbase remains.

Star Fox is, and always should be, a 3D space shooter. People get into games like Star Fox because they like the type of game. Ever since the release of Star Fox Adventures, there has been a rift in the fanbase between those who want the series to follow SFAd, and those who want the series to stay what it has always been. This has not been good for the fandom, and the last thing we need is an influx of (Racing | RPG | MMO | FPS | Puzzle | Platformer | RTS | ____________ ) Game fans to further fracture the fanbase.

If Nintendo wanted to create a new Space (Racing | RPG | MMO | Adventure | FPS | Puzzle | Platformer | RTS | ____________ ) Game, they should either use an existing apropriate franchise, or start a new one.

In some ways, I agree with you, but there are many, many other popular games that had genre/gameplay shifts and innovations yet still remain popular and enjoyable. Star Fox's issues are from the way that the games themselves are executed- rushed and poorly planned, and sloppy plotting that mars what could otherwise be an interesting foray into deeper story lines. Even the last game, which was a 3D space shooter, left people grumbling and moaning.

[Guest Julius Quasar]

In some ways, I agree with you, but there are many, many other popular games that had genre/gameplay shifts and innovations yet still remain popular and enjoyable. Star Fox's issues are from the way that the games themselves are executed- rushed and poorly planned, and sloppy plotting that mars what could otherwise be an interesting foray into deeper story lines. Even the last game, which was a 3D space shooter, left people grumbling and moaning.

This ^

very good, rainfyre66! :yes:

[Kursed]

In some ways, I agree with you, but there are many, many other popular games that had genre/gameplay shifts and innovations yet still remain popular and enjoyable. Star Fox's issues are from the way that the games themselves are executed- rushed and poorly planned, and sloppy plotting that mars what could otherwise be an interesting foray into deeper story lines. Even the last game, which was a 3D space shooter, left people grumbling and moaning.

yes it was the gameplay + the bad story that reall y made command a bad game Assualt was good but was a litle sloppy better than command though because at least the gameplay and controls were easier .

[Guest Julius Quasar]

yes it was the gameplay + the bad story that reall y made command a bad game Assualt was good but was a litle sloppy better than command though because at least the gameplay and controls were easier .

Yeah, that about sums it up in a SF-Assault vs. SF-Command debate.

[DZComposer]

In some ways, I agree with you, but there are many, many other popular games that had genre/gameplay shifts and innovations yet still remain popular and enjoyable.

On the same scale as this? It's one thing to move from a side-scrolling shooter to a full 3D FPS (it's still a shooter...). It's another to move from a 3D vehicle shooter to a Zelda-Style adventure game.

EDIT: Don't mention Mario. Mario is Nintendo's mascot, thus they ca pretty much do anything with him and get away with it. Besides, it's not like Mario and Sonic at The Olympic Games is part of the mainline Mario series...

Star Fox's issues are from the way that the games themselves are executed- rushed and poorly planned, and sloppy plotting that mars what could otherwise be an interesting foray into deeper story lines. Even the last game, which was a 3D space shooter, left people grumbling and moaning.

True, but throwing genre shifts in with these problems will only make things worse.

I know what I am talking about with what genre-shifts to do a fanbase. I saw it happen first-hand. I first became active in the SF fan community in late 1999. When SFAd dropped, there was a rift that damn-near destroyed the SF fanbase. I do not want this to happen again, as I do not think the fanbase would survive it. It is not even close to as robust as it was in 2001.

And you can't fault game quality for that. SFAd was a pretty decent adventure game. The issue is that it was delivered to a bunch of 3D space shooter fans...

[Guest Julius Quasar]

On the same scale as this? It's one thing to move from a side-scrolling shooter to a full 3D FPS (it's still a shooter...). It's another to move from a 3D vehicle shooter to a Zelda-Style adventure game.

True, but throwing genre shifts in with these problems will only make things worse.

I know what I am talking about with what genre-shifts to do a fanbase. I saw it happen first-hand. I first became active in the SF fan community in late 1999. When SFAd dropped, there was a rift that damn-near destroyed the SF fanbase. I do not want this to happen again, as I do not think the fanbase would survive it. It is not even close to as robust as it was in 2001.

And you can't fault game quality for that. SFAd was a pretty decent adventure game. The issue is that it was delivered to a bunch of 3D space shooter fans...

True dat, true dat...

What I'd like is if they could make Star Fox's game play and music score like that of Ace Combat [5]

[DZComposer]

You mind if I borrow that format occasionally DZ? It may prove very useful in the future >.>

lol, sure. Just credit me if anyone asks.

What I'd like is if they could make Star Fox's game play and music score like that of Ace Combat [5]

That reminds me of one of the early SFAs rumors: that it was to be developed by the Ace Combat dev team. lol

[Guest Julius Quasar]

That reminds me of one of the early SFAs rumors: that it was to be developed by the Ace Combat dev team. lol

Seriously!? Cool! :yes:

[Andrew McCloud]

Thanks DZ

And I can say from experience the same thing DZC is saying. I was here when SF.org, lylat.net, and sfx64.com were still huge sites. Almost all of them were eventually abandoned do to the rift that Adventures created in the fandom (among other things).

What we have today is barely a fraction of the popularity and activeness we had back in 2000.

[rainfyre66]

I know what I am talking about with what genre-shifts to do a fanbase. I saw it happen first-hand. I first became active in the SF fan community in late 1999. When SFAd dropped, there was a rift that damn-near destroyed the SF fanbase. I do not want this to happen again, as I do not think the fanbase would survive it. It is not even close to as robust as it was in 2001.

And you can't fault game quality for that. SFAd was a pretty decent adventure game. The issue is that it was delivered to a bunch of 3D space shooter fans...

I don't completely disagree with you, perhaps I was stretcing it a bit with my original opening statement, but there are other factors among the current Star Fox community that you aren't taking into account. I was a huge fan from when Star Fox was released in '93 (and had my fair share of grumbles over the SF64's rewriting of history and such), and was quite shocked to discover they were making an RPG Star Fox. I wasn't a nay-sayer, I was actually kind of intrigued by the concept, but I do understand that others were furious. I was not active into games anymore at that time, so didn't really follow the SF fan community reactions, but imagine there was plenty of heated debate.

However, I think the game quality of SF Adventure does play a role in fan decine. I'm sticking with what is the general consensus of SFAd- while not a bad game overall, it is clearly not a Star Fox game. Nintendo and Rare did not tie Dinosaur Planet and Star Fox together as seamlessly as they could have. Thus, the hardcore nay-sayers of the concept in the first place were proven right in that a Star Fox RPG does not work. Had Nintendo taken it upon themselves to create a true Star Fox RPG, without the existing material from a completely different game, it might have been able to hold onto its fanbase a little better. (And yes, I am aware that a SF RPG would probably never have even been considered had Dinosaur Planet not been created in the first place.)SF Adventures and its genre shift can be held accountable for the major damage of lessening SF's fanbase.

Yet now, there are a good number of SF fans who have followed the other titles of the series because they played and loved SF Adventures first. SF fans of today are a bit more open minded to genre variations of the game because they've had a wide variety available to them. Most arguments against Assault and Command are given mainly to their poorly planned gameplay and plotting. Sure, there may have been more on foot missions than necessary in Assault, but it's still keeping it a form of a shooter game, and most people's complaints about that were the poor programming of said levels.  As for SFC, well, Fox stays in his Arwing the whole time, yet fans still managed to find every other little thing to complain about when it came to that game (controls, storylines, etc.) which is farily ironic since it was based off of Star Fox 2's gameplay style, so who knows, Star Fox may have began tanking if they had realeased that game.

At this point, those who abandoned the series after their dislike of SFAd are probably not going to come back to the series regardless of whether Fox is flying around shooting stuff or not. Those who have learned to love the rest of the series by playing Adventures and the fans who have learned to just roll with the random punches of the Star Fox series will still probably just go along with what they throw our way. Such a drastic change has already been done and has already skewed the fanbase, and while the fanbase is still split in a sense, the most major damage has already been done. I still stand by my point that it was the rushed quality of the games from SF Adventures and on that further declined the fanbase after SFAd had weakened it. Also, Nintendo overestimated Fox's mascot appeal. If a game is good, people will buy it. If a game is not receiving much hype because it is a mediocre game, than it will not sell as well.

So I guess my major point is there is no denying that SFAd did major damage to the fanbase, however, it did create new fans of that style of gameplay that coexist peacefully among the older yet accepting fans, and the poorer game quality of the games that followed contributed to a further decline in the SF community as opposed to the games' deviations from 3D rail shooter. And with such a broader range of fans that exist now, it seems natural if they are going to tinker around and experiment with innovating an existing franchise that Star Fox would be the one.

I understand that you prefer Star Fox as a 3D shooter and are firm in your beliefs that that is what SF should be, and that as administrator of the board that pretty much gives you ability and authority to have final say in the discussion. However, I do hope you find some good points in what I have stated. These are merely our points of view, neither is 100% correct fact. While there is truth and facts in our statements, much of it is still influenced and biased by our own opinions and personality. I do mean this all respectfully.

(EDIT: And sweet thunder, upon viewing after posting, sorry for rambling the point, had far too much caffeine and not nearly enough sleep today. That'll do it.)

[ThePointingMan]

He he I like your post, even if it is rambling, Reminds me of the biology section of science, Mutual relationships, maybe a bit of predation.

Me myself and I's favorites of the series are assault, 64, and the snes ones. I do enjoy the others, but I don't play them nearly as often, so i have to conclude, that the other three that I play all the time, would be my favorites.

Right there kinda points out a point... err something like that, you'll notice my favorites are all the ones that didn't go all... different.

But then again, very often I have seen things of people saying they came to the rest of the Starfox series because they played adventure(which I liked until the redeye tribe, then got less, something and more... something else.)

Bla, I dunno, don even feel like thinking bout it anymore, could go either way really, just requires me to scavenge for brainability, and I already scavenge enough at school when I'm looking for a pencil someone may have left on the floor.

[Kursed]

I had no problem with the readeye tribe just the trapdoor in cloud runner castle.

[DZComposer]

Let me start off by saying that I do not believe in using my admin powers just because I disagree with somebody. And if I ever do, I want someone to call me out on it to snap me back into reality.

Now, back to the topic at hand:

I am not saying that SFAs and SFC had no major role in the series decline. Had SFAs been done right, it may well have mitigated much of the damage caused by SFAd.

Did SFAd bring new people in? Yes. But it also made some good people leave.

I just feel SFAd has been a net negative overall, and I do not think we need to go through that again.