Corneria vs. Earth

[Sabre]

Come on people, I was talking seriously.

About pollution, yes, just google for the Riachuelo in Argentina and I bet 1.000.000 Pesos that they do not have anything like that on Corneria.

Of course the Cornerian forces are foolish, which would give terran pilots some advantage, but there is still the technological diference. Yeah, their fighters would not be unbeatable, but in the hands of a group of skilled pilots (and I just do not mean only Star Fox) they would be able to take down entire air forces.

Even if they are still stupid, they could send in more and more until Earth just can not hold. Country after country would fall and eventually the Cornerian flag will stand high in all terran lands. That is why I mentioned the fact that then we will need a multi-national force like XCOM. At first it will not do any good, but in the long term the combined might of Earth would do it.

Since when to Corneria have unlimited resources?

[SPEAKERnight.]

and since when ANY planet, fictional or not, have unlimted resources (save air and water)

[Guest FoXXX]

In this specific case, I would play traitor too. Maybe they will let me govern my country. And maybe I could finally get my furry gf too  .

I want a furry gf too :D

[Guest DRL]

I NEVER SAID unlimited resources, I just said that Earth would lose. It is inevitable.

You can not defeat a superior technological foe that easy. What I said was that unless Earth unites it´s forces under a single flag and tries to catch up the technological lead (in any ways possible, mostly reverse-engineering their ships would help.) Earth forces are weaker. Let´s face it. Considering the current situation, each nation is likely to go on it´s own. Yeah, Europeans would help Europeans, USA will help it´s allies too, ect. But in the long term a united force would be needed. That way it would be possible to gain the necesary technological components to defeat them. Then, once both of these are done, Earth will we in a position more than apropiate to fight back. BUT unless this happen, Earth is a relatively weak target.

[Guest FoXXX]

I NEVER SAID unlimited resources, I just said that Earth would lose. It is inevitable.

You can not defeat a superior technological foe that easy. What I said was that unless Earth unites it´s forces under a single flag and tries to catch up the technological lead (in any ways possible, mostly reverse-engineering their ships would help.) Earth forces are weaker. Let´s face it. Considering the current situation, each nation is likely to go on it´s own. Yeah, Europeans would help Europeans, USA will help it´s allies too, ect. But in the long term a united force would be needed. That way it would be possible to gain the necesary technological components to defeat them. Then, once both of these are done, Earth will we in a position more than apropiate to fight back. BUT unless this happen, Earth is a relatively weak target.

Our forces our independent, as Corneria is not, they're a lot smarter than us

[Sableye]

Our forces our independent, as Corneria is not, they're a lot smarter than us

Kay. Can anyone tell me where is the "assumed" location in real space is Corneria if it exists.

[Guest DRL]

Kay. Can anyone tell me where is the "assumed" location in real space is Corneria if it exists.

I really do not care. Even if they just be next system, our chances from winning are, at this very moment, equal to 0%. Their chances of total victory I calculate, at a starting point, at least (considering ALL disadvantes they have) over 30%. This percentage would gradually increase as terran countries are being defeated.

[Asper Sarnoff]

I fail to see how anyone can even consider Corneria chances for winning a war against earth as good. Let's look at the facts.

Corneria was completely overrun, on the brink of surrendering when a team of only four pilots came in and did what they could not. We may be talking the best pilots in the system, but still only four.

In my opinion, the Cornerian defense force reeks of absolute incompetence. Even someone who's military experience consists of a few hours playing Command & Conquer would do a better job directing an army into war than the Cornerian army command.

And to be fair, technology doesn't have as much to say as one might think. Our weapons would still be more than deadly enough to get the job done. I guess many of you have seen Cameron's Avatar. In the final battle, the humans brought to the field technology wastly superior to what the natives could muster. But they still lost, mostly due to the greater numbers of the natives, which is an advantage it is natural to estimate earth have over Corneria.

And the technological advance the humans had over the natives there, was far, far greater than what Corneria has over earth.

The only way Corneria could potentially defeat earth is by fielding some kind of super weapon, like the Gorgon of SF64. But Corneria doesn't have that kind of weapon, and neither would they use it if they had it I suspect.

Judging from the few facts we actually have to work with. I'd say the entire Cornerian army would struggle to conquer a small country with a somewhat decent military, let alone the whole planet.

[Sabre]

I fail to see how anyone can even consider Corneria chances for winning a war against earth as good. Let's look at the facts.

Corneria was completely overrun, on the brink of surrendering when a team of only four pilots came in and did what they could not. We may be talking the best pilots in the system, but still only four.

In my opinion, the Cornerian defense force reeks of absolute incompetence. Even someone who's military experience consists of a few hours playing Command & Conquer would do a better job directing an army into war than the Cornerian army command.

And to be fair, technology doesn't have as much to say as one might think. Our weapons would still be more than deadly enough to get the job done. I guess many of you have seen Cameron's Avatar. In the final battle, the humans brought to the field technology wastly superior to what the natives could muster. But they still lost, mostly due to the greater numbers of the natives, which is an advantage it is natural to estimate earth have over Corneria.

And the technological advance the humans had over the natives there, was far, far greater than what Corneria has over earth.

The only way Corneria could potentially defeat earth is by fielding some kind of super weapon, like the Gorgon of SF64. But Corneria doesn't have that kind of weapon, and neither would they use it if they had it I suspect.

Judging from the few facts we actually have to work with. I'd say the entire Cornerian army would struggle to conquer a small country with a somewhat decent military, let alone the whole planet.

Indeed. A better, real world example is Britain vs the Zulus. We had guns, but enough men with spears could overrun them or just burn all their ammo. It wasn't until we invented the machine gun that we started winning.

Technolagy doesn't really matter either. Lazer (in SF) are unlimited, yes, but I'd imagine we'd reverse engeneer that kind of stuff really quickly. Not only that, but they are also slow enough to step out of the way of.

Then there's the home turf advantage. Iraq, Vietnam, Zulus again. Knowlage of the terrain and how to exploit make digging out resistance difficult. The only way I think they would win would be if it was a range war, ie space super weapons, but we've already established that Corneria doesn't do that.

[Braux]

Ok, so this topic really got my attention, these two above me pretty much sum up what I was going to say. Corneria had a horrid defence force, so what would their offence force be like? Imagine that.

Plus, I see that most of Corneria's weapon systems rely on electricity, or some form of it, what would a strategically placed HEMP (high-altitude electromagnetic pulse) do to them? Pretty much take out their weapons systems, and cripple the way their war is fought. Now what? throw some rocks and hope it does some damage? :P

[Guest FoXXX]

Kay. Can anyone tell me where is the "assumed" location in real space is Corneria if it exists.

Doesn't really matter, since they can warp through space...

[Guest DRL]

Ok, so this topic really got my attention, these two above me pretty much sum up what I was going to say. Corneria had a horrid defence force, so what would their offence force be like? Imagine that.

Plus, I see that most of Corneria's weapon systems rely on electricity, or some form of it, what would a strategically placed HEMP (high-altitude electromagnetic pulse) do to them? Pretty much take out their weapons systems, and cripple the way their war is fought. Now what? throw some rocks and hope it does some damage?

But the side effect of such weapon is that it would also disable terran based electronic weapons as well. Terran Aircraft and Sea Forces would be rendered almost useless then.

---------------------------------

It seems nobody here ever played a X-COM game. Well, do it. The results seem pretty realistic. Yeah, nobody has ever won a victory without a battle, but you just can not hold on forever. These games are a fine example of it. Currently Earth would just be able to hold on. Face it. If an alien invasion comes, we will be forced to put our diferences aside and unite forces. Maybe not a "United Nation" but a "Combined Earth Defence Force" would do it.

But, if you say Earth at this very moment, with each nation going on it´s own, it would pretty much lose. Natives?, Low-tech places? Just nuke 'em. A nova bomb would do it. As for bigger cities, all they must do is to keep sending more and more fighters. Even if they are stupid, they would eventually outnumber us in the air. Mid-Tech countries such as South American ones could be used as landing points. Eventually a combined air & ground attack would subdue even the most powerfull terran nation.

- Also, we have never seen Corneria in offensive, thus we can not be sure of how effective they really are.

Wars are won by strategy. I mean, if they wish they would be able to bombard the planet from orbit. What we would do? Launch nukes? Aside from their ineffectiveness, they would not be able to deal enough damage, simply because they would be shot down before they could reach their targets. We just would not be able to reach their ships, which automatically gives them a tactical victory.

... I noticed that you are mostly defending Earth because of your human pride, but I am viewing it from a military point. Unless some key steps are taken, Earth is an easy prey to an alien invasion. Forget about Corneria, any alien force would do it. And even if it is Corneria, all they need is an efficient comander, and listo.

[Sabre]

I played Xcom under it's real name UFO. The fan remake is awesome.

Also they cant just keep sending more and more fighters. They would have limited amount (jumping this far wont be an easy task)

EDIT: I'm not a human pride type guy. Im talking the huge logistical challenge of getting here to attack at all.

[Guest DRL]

I played Xcom under it's real name UFO. The fan remake is awesome.

Also they cant just keep sending more and more fighters. They would have limited amount (jumping this far wont be an easy task)

Yes it is.

And if you played UFO: Enemy Unknown, you know they can. They can just manufacture more and more, go back home to pick them up, and take them there. At first we would not have to fight a large force, but as the need arises, they would send in larger ships (battlecrusiers, ect.)

To defeat them, Earth must reverse-engineer componets of any captured ship(s).

Then use this tech to build adapted carriers and fighters, and beat the Cornerians in their own turf.

I agree that part would be easy, since Corneria sucks at defence (considering also the fact that adapted ships would have capabilities similar to their own).

[Guest Julius Quasar]

That's awesome!

If Corneria and Earth went to war, I would SO betray planet Earth and help pave the way for Cornerian invasion. 

Me too, screw this place

In this specific case, I would play traitor too. Maybe they will let me govern my country. And maybe I could finally get my furry gf too  .

That would be awesome!  Especially having a furry gf! :D

[Guest DRL]

That would be awesome!  Especially having a furry gf!

He,he...  :lol:

[Vy'drach]

Did you just quote yourself, Julius?

And I'd think it'd be pretty cool to spend some time with the furries too, but I imagine we'd be as strange to them as they'd be to the majority of us.

[Guest Julius Quasar]

Did you just quote yourself, Julius?

And I'd think it'd be pretty cool to spend some time with the furries too, but I imagine we'd be as strange to them as they'd be to the majority of us.

sorta.  I was quoting what someone said in response to one of my posts.  I quoted my post as....I dunno, I just felt it had to be a "package deal"... :S

[Guest DRL]

Did you just quote yourself, Julius?

And I'd think it'd be pretty cool to spend some time with the furries too, but I imagine we'd be as strange to them as they'd be to the majority of us.

After the war, whatever the result is, I would volunter myself to be a diplomat  .

Specially if they win.

[Vy'drach]

I'm just messing with you Julius lol, mostly because just a few minutes prior to seeing that, I was about to quote myself to so I didn't have to write something again, and would just continue off it.

[Guest Julius Quasar]

I'm just messing with you Julius lol, mostly because just a few minutes prior to seeing that, I was about to quote myself to so I didn't have to write something again, and would just continue off it.

Oh, okay.

Back OT,

You can tell that Corneria never had a "Dark Ages" period, that's why their sciences and technologies are better than Earth's.

[Vy'drach]

Not necessarily there, Julius, a theory is that if there are alien civilizations, they likely went through the same sort of periods as earth, not necessarily the same minerals such as stone and bronze, but equivalents, through gunpowder and nuclear, but they advanced faster, or started earlier, than humans.

[Sabre]

Yes it is.

And if you played UFO: Enemy Unknown, you know they can. They can just manufacture more and more, go back home to pick them up, and take them there. At first we would not have to fight a large force, but as the need arises, they would send in larger ships (battlecrusiers, ect.)

To defeat them, Earth must reverse-engineer componets of any captured ship(s).

Then use this tech to build adapted carriers and fighters, and beat the Cornerians in their own turf.

I agree that part would be easy, since Corneria sucks at defence (considering also the fact that adapted ships would have capabilities similar to their own).

No, only the first one, and it's horribly dated. Got the set on steam for £3 recently. It's the yanky name unfortunatly, but I minor detail. But we are not talking about the UFO aliens, were taking corneria, and only the independence day level from the N64 showed anything like that, and even that they were no match for anything as advances as SF ships, so maybe it would be be comprable in ability.

[Guest DRL]

Not necessarily there, Julius, a theory is that if there are alien civilizations, they likely went through the same sort of periods as earth, not necessarily the same minerals such as stone and bronze, but equivalents, through gunpowder and nuclear, but they advanced faster, or started earlier, than humans.

Earth (or more properly, Europe) went through a Dark Age for religious reasons.

No, only the first one, and it's horribly dated. Got the set on steam for £3 recently. It's the yanky name unfortunatly, but I minor detail. But we are not talking about the UFO aliens, were taking corneria, and only the independence day level from the N64 showed anything like that, and even that they were no match for anything as advances as SF ships, so maybe it would be be comprable in ability.

But even still we have the trouble of off-world bombardement, should they decide to use it.

Anyways, I think it would go like this (if everything goes fine)...:

1) Unknown agression or hostility starts a war between the humans and cornerians.

2) Initial technological advantage, added to terran factionalism allows the cornerians some victories.

3) United Nations realizes that current forces are not capable of winnign the war, and creates a new defence force, one that would defend entire Earth and the Sol system. Every terran nation has to provide support for it, even if they can give very limited support, they must support it.

4) Earth scores some tactical victories, in which cornerian wreckages are succesfully recovered and researched, maily reverse-engineered.

5) Earth produces it´s own version of fighters. As the desings prove succesfull, Earth beggins the construction of it´s own carriers.

6) Earth secures Sol system and (if no diplomatic solution was found) prepares to invade the enemy system.

7) Earth scores victories all over Lylat. Planet after planet falls.

8) Corneria is forced to sing a peace treatry, in which it recognizes Earth´s idependence and territorial supremacy over Sol (and maybe farther).

9) Peace. And the beggining of a new era in space travel for Earth and it´s inhabitants.

[Vy'drach]

Earth went through a Dark Age for religious reasons.

What, an alien civilization wouldn't have a time where religious powers were also the acting government?