Really, why am I here?

[Dermot]

I may be influenced by having...missed my meds today.  That can screw with my moods.  So I'm finding myself feeling really pessimistic.  Maybe later I'll decide this thread was unnecessary, I don't know.

Why am I here?  Here on SFO.  I've been thinking about it.

I think I really wanted to recapture something I'd lost from the MouthOff and Papetoon days.  I missed all the girls and guys who loved Star Fox.  I mean, for a while, I fell out of the Star Fox fandom because I lost interest in everything else people were into.  I wasn't into Star Fox 64, or Adventures, or Assault, really...  I mean, I remained a fan of the old SNES game and its storyline, and I thought there were nice characters and arcs introduced in the newer stories (NOT KRYSTAL *sound of glass shattering for dramatic effect, then everything's normal and peachy again*).

I think I can pinpoint the moment when I felt a sudden turnaround, and my interest in Star Fox was revived once again.  I was reading "Farewell, Beloved Falco", and Falco - my favorite character - turned out to be gay, just like I'd always thought!  ...or so it seemed.  After some gossip with my friends, I started getting involved more in Star Fox at tvtropes, then at Arwingpedia, then I came here.  Imagine to my disappointment...that most of the people I was meeting not only scoughed at this, but I found myself drawn into argument after argument, and people even trying to butt heads with me over it.  For some assurance, I went back to my friends, and...sure enough, they still thought so.  I even asked some of my straight friends (what few I have), at a bi friend's insistence that I ask more than just LGBT friends.

So my Star Fox interest started to blossom anew, just like when I discovered things like Circles, i.s.o., Carpe Diem, Arashi no Yoru ni, Newshounds, Vinci & Arty, Wild Arms 2, etc.  See, you have to understand something - a gay character (especially one with a realistic personality) can be especially relatable to the gay audience, and is a refreshing and liberating change from the parade of straight guy characters who like things we could care less about.  Rather than a focus of some sort of desire, the gay character is, to some degree, a link between the story and the audience.  The things this guy goes through, we can relate to, and we feel immersed in a storyline in a way we often find lacking in other stories.

But now that I'm here, I've made a lot of new friends...but I've also made enemies - people who find me annoying, or harass me, or just plain don't like gay people.  And I'm deeply disappointed at how few women fans and other gay guy fans there are around here.  Very often, I feel quite alone, even when talking to many sympathetic people I've met here since I arrived.  And I'm feeling an old all-too-familiar feeling - that I stick out like a sore thumb.  See, I don't have a fear of difference, but I have a fear of being alone in a community, where the things I say are completely different from everyone else in a rather stark, cold way.  I don't want to be the lone wolf, so to say.

Recently, I've been contacting more Star Fox fans I used to know, and more fans I know from FurAffinity, and asking if they wouldn't consider making a presence here.  And so far...no one has been interested.  The reasons vary - "no time" - "not into chitchat" - but the most telling reason I've encountered is "I don't like Star Fox after 64".  And really...that's true, isn't it?  A lot of people can't stand the newer wave of Star Fox games.  Maybe that's part of why the series is in such stagnation - every new release since 64 has been less successful than the preceding release, and none have been more successful even than SNES Star Fox (the second most successful of the series).  Star Fox 64 got the best reviews, Star Fox Assault was the most panned by critics.  By the time Star Fox Command came around, too few people were interested.  And me, I don't even like Star Fox 64.

So what has been keeping my renewed interest alive?  Because Star Fox characters remain consistently well-liked by the gay furry community - which is where I spend most of my time.  And I've found tons of new good fanart (mostly out of Japan), and most of it is very gay.  I keep hoping - surely, the gay fans are here on SFO, if I just keep looking for them.  And I've found a tiny few.  But for the most part, all the gay fans I know are either (1) Japanese, or (2) won't go outside FurAffinity.  They don't really think much of places like SFO.  The old fans I contacted from the MouthOff/Papetoon days - they mostly don't think much of places like SFO either.

So really, what are my activities here?  For the most part, I...make random comments, or start some polls, or post random fanart threads, or maintain my ever-more-elaborate signature, and I was also here to announce a new MIDI, and I even made an honest-to-goodness fanwork that ended up making so many people uncomfortable it was moved to the mature board.  But really, what else was there than that?  I still risk getting my head bitten off if I talk about the real source of my renewed interest.  Yesterday, when I posted (with permission) part of a chat log as a cultural snapshot of the gay Star Fox fandom, it almost ignited a flamewar!  I just about snapped, and wanted to smack anyone who wouldn't take my fan impetus seriously.  Star Fox is one of my gay interests - and I miss my gay friends being around to talk about my interests with.  Even the fans who really like Star Fox don't want to come here.

So...I'm fan-lonely.  Very, very fan-lonely.  What exactly about SFO is so undesirable and radioactive to my friends?  And why does my fan interest have to be so repulsive to anyone here to the point of ripping my head off or trying to drive me out?  I want to feel more than just liked or invited.  I want to...fit in...and just as much, I want a place I'll fit into.  I've been a big Star Fox fan for more than half my life, and I'm just not feeling that rosy communal feeling lately.  I feel burned out.

Anyway, some pre-emptive comments:

(you know who you are): Don't bother responding, I don't want to hear it.

Milkyway64: I'm too depressed for a debate.

Robert Monroe: I'm not a good foil right now.

Steve: I hope you still love my cookies, because I'm feeling very uncreative right now.

DRL, Julius Quasar, Sylum, anyone else I may have forgotten: You've been great to me.  I don't really know how to be great to you all. All I can think to discuss are SNES Star Fox, SNES Star Fox music, romance fanart, and how much I admire Falco for being an inspirational fictional gay character.  And considering I do the latter at my own peril, I currently feel very, very depressed and very, very discouraged.

[Geo Stelar]

Just do what is right; then you would be great enough. :)

[Steve]

Eh, I dunno, my signature speaks for me:

""“A man’s life is determined by his actions, will and thoughts. Life’s too short to dwell into aggravating memories and sadness”"

Just don't overdo yourself.

[CrypticQuery]

:shock: That IS A LOT OF TEXT! (Which takes some serious dedication )

Don't feel discouraged about anything, there are always going to be things that never agree in life, and while you may have stumbled upon quite a bit of them recently, you must push past them.  There isn't anything to get discouraged over, so don't worry about it .

[DZComposer]

I've tried to make this as welcoming of a place as I can to ALL fans, regardless of culture, race, religion, sexual preference, or gender.

Sadly, I cannot wish away prejudice. I can remove hateful posts, but general attitudes and dislike I cannot remove.

I have a great amount of respect for you because you are one of the pivotal people in the development of the Star Fox fanbase. Without Papetoon and Mouth Off, none of this would likely exist now. But, you are a very different person than many here, and that has made some people nervous around you. The fanbase isn't what it was in the late 1990s, and polarizing political speech on Gay issues has lit a fire around it that wasn't there in the 1990s. It's a different time.

You must do what you feel is right, of course, but I hope you can find a way to stick around.

[Guest Julius Quasar]

Dermot, buddy, there are far worse place to be than here.  I've been to sites where someone like you was harassed mercilessly, unfairly banned, or had ALL their threads locked or deleted, and they were flamed constantly, to the point where they had to hide from view.  The irony was, those sites were full of people claiming to be "Tolerant", "Open Minded", and "Liberal", when in reality, they are the most stuck up, hypocritical, snobby elitist pricks in existence.  Feel better. 

[Guest DRL]

If it depended on me, there would never be such thing as prejuice,

but sadly there is.

Diversity and different views are the key to a succesful, friendly

fanbase - If there is 'only' one view or opinion 'allowed', it is nothing

more that selective elitism.

Sure, we may not see the characters or games with the same eyes,

but we see the same characters and we love them, that is why we

are fans, right? Again, there is nothing wrong in having a different

view. Yes, there is someone around who finds you annoying, we all

know it. BUT, do not be discouraged by it - if you go away then

it will be a victory for prejuice, something I would never like to see.

Again, do not feel bad. I am sure everyone likes the place to be

alive, and it means having fans of all kinds, not just 'some'.

I mean, I do not like Command and I would be really happy if

they leave it as a non-canon spin-off, yet around there are some

who say it is the best, for example, and I never had an argument

with any of them so far, because we respect everyone.

If you ask me, I say that the more, the merrier. Sure, bring your

friends if you can. I am sure everyone will welcome them nicely

and hopefully that would make the fanbase more diverse, I think.

[Dermot]

Okay, today I have (just) remembered my meds.  I just need to let them take effect.  I hope I can be sunnier today.  I've had to take these pills since I was 16 - they don't take away the blues or the worries, but they make them easier to deal with.  Without them, I'm like a different person.  After a day things are usually not too different.  After a week without them, I'm a complete mess.

I wonder if what I said was something I've been feeling awhile, but I was in better spirits and with less anxiety, and I didn't feel like bringing it up.  But before I went to bed (when I wrote this entry), I was feeling it really, really heavily.

I'll wait a little while before I make a real reply.

["User"]

Dermot, buddy, there are far worse place to be than here.  I've been to sites where someone like you was harassed mercilessly, unfairly banned, or had ALL their threads locked or deleted, and they were flamed constantly, to the point where they had to hide from view.  The irony was, those sites were full of people claiming to be "Tolerant", "Open Minded", and "Liberal", when in reality, they are the most stuck up, hypocritical, snobby elitist pricks in existence.  Feel better.

^^ This.  SFO is one the most friendly forums that I've been to out there.  On other sites I frequent like LQArena.com you'd not only be relentlessly mocked for constantly bringing up things like this or making topics about it but you'd probably also get some other indirect off site harassment as well.  I'd personally be thankful to be part of a site like this where everyone is very open minded and accepting.

[Dermot]

Okay.  I think I'm feeling a bit more grounded. :3

Thanks everyone, and especially DZ - you are correct.  The times are different, the fandom is different.  Even trying to re-establish MouthOff today would not necessarily change that.  This probably is one of the best places for the fandom today.  Probably good enough to even try to re-invite some of the fangirls I know.  Afterall, you can't exactly maintain a fan niche without vigilance of some sort.  Falco isn't going to stop being one of my favorite fictional gay characters anytime soon.

I will try not to feel so disheartened and discouraged.

[ThePointingMan]

So I'm just wandering... whats the issue... I haven't seen any conflict involving you, and have no idea whats going on, I'm seeing a lot of you saying your sorry an stuff, but... I don't know whats going on...

[Dermot]

So I'm just wandering... whats the issue... I haven't seen any conflict involving you, and have no idea whats going on, I'm seeing a lot of you saying your sorry an stuff, but... I don't know whats going on...

If you haven't seen it, then it's...complicated.

[ThePointingMan]

Alrighty! Good enough for meh.

[Robert Monroe]

*cue Starwolf theme* CAN'T LET YOU POST THAT, DERMOT.

I may be influenced by having...missed my meds today.  That can screw with my moods.  So I'm finding myself feeling really pessimistic.  Maybe later I'll decide this thread was unnecessary, I don't know.

"Why am I here" topics tend to be unnecessary, but take that as you will.

Why am I here?  Here on SFO.  I've been thinking about it.

I think I really wanted to recapture something I'd lost from the MouthOff and Papetoon days.  I missed all the girls and guys who loved Star Fox.  I mean, for a while, I fell out of the Star Fox fandom because I lost interest in everything else people were into.  I wasn't into Star Fox 64, or Adventures, or Assault, really...  I mean, I remained a fan of the old SNES game and its storyline, and I thought there were nice characters and arcs introduced in the newer stories (NOT KRYSTAL *sound of glass shattering for dramatic effect, then everything's normal and peachy again*).

I remember old days on message boards too. For me, it was RareExtreme, the McCloud Space Station, and Outside the Greatfox. Those days are gone by, but I do understand you in some form here: SFO gives me an odd sense of nostalgia. I was dissapointed in Adventures, hated Assault, and don't even OWN Command, so much like you, I live in days gone by, adhering mostly to just the SNES and N64 games, although I do like Panther.

And your mentioning of Krystal I'm going to take as a joke, because otherwise is borderline flamebaiting.

I think I can pinpoint the moment when I felt a sudden turnaround, and my interest in Star Fox was revived once again.  I was reading "Farewell, Beloved Falco", and Falco - my favorite character - turned out to be gay, just like I'd always thought!  ...or so it seemed.  After some gossip with my friends, I started getting involved more in Star Fox at tvtropes, then at Arwingpedia, then I came here.  Imagine to my disappointment...that most of the people I was meeting not only scoughed at this, but I found myself drawn into argument after argument, and people even trying to butt heads with me over it.  For some assurance, I went back to my friends, and...sure enough, they still thought so.  I even asked some of my straight friends (what few I have), at a bi friend's insistence that I ask more than just LGBT friends.

And here is where you fumble. Falco ISN'T gay. He may not be straight, either, but he is no more gay as well. It's your interpertation of his character. Everyone has their own, and yours is at odds with the majority of fans, especially considering mny people slash Falco with Fox or whoever else because "zomg so sexay", not because they have DEEP PROFOUND INSIGHT on their own character interpertation. You straight friends, mean nothing. Bi friends, also mean nothing. I've got more bi and gay friends than I do straight friends, and they would all disagree with you, Dermot, on Falco. There is no"canon" here, it's all personal interpertation.

So my Star Fox interest started to blossom anew, just like when I discovered things like Circles, i.s.o., Carpe Diem, Arashi no Yoru ni, Newshounds, Vinci & Arty, Wild Arms 2, etc.  See, you have to understand something - a gay character (especially one with a realistic personality) can be especially relatable to the gay audience, and is a refreshing and liberating change from the parade of straight guy characters who like things we could care less about.  Rather than a focus of some sort of desire, the gay character is, to some degree, a link between the story and the audience.  The things this guy goes through, we can relate to, and we feel immersed in a storyline in a way we often find lacking in other stories.

That can be said about ANY well written character. It's not exclusive to just gay characters, and they best written "minority" characters don't have their "minority" written as a part of their character. IE, you can make a female a male, a straight man gay, and the character will be unchaged in how well they are done. When a character's focus is on their "gimmick", then they lose credibility as a character, because they trade in actual writing for riding on the minority ticket.

But now that I'm here, I've made a lot of new friends...but I've also made enemies - people who find me annoying, or harass me, or just plain don't like gay people.  And I'm deeply disappointed at how few women fans and other gay guy fans there are around here.  Very often, I feel quite alone, even when talking to many sympathetic people I've met here since I arrived.  And I'm feeling an old all-too-familiar feeling - that I stick out like a sore thumb.  See, I don't have a fear of difference, but I have a fear of being alone in a community, where the things I say are completely different from everyone else in a rather stark, cold way.  I don't want to be the lone wolf, so to say.

There isn't much that can be done here. You're the only gay person I know of on this board. Like everyone else has said, you at least have a mostly-welcoming and accepting community.

Recently, I've been contacting more Star Fox fans I used to know, and more fans I know from FurAffinity, and asking if they wouldn't consider making a presence here.  And so far...no one has been interested.  The reasons vary - "no time" - "not into chitchat" - but the most telling reason I've encountered is "I don't like Star Fox after 64".  And really...that's true, isn't it?  A lot of people can't stand the newer wave of Star Fox games.  Maybe that's part of why the series is in such stagnation - every new release since 64 has been less successful than the preceding release, and none have been more successful even than SNES Star Fox (the second most successful of the series).  Star Fox 64 got the best reviews, Star Fox Assault was the most panned by critics.  By the time Star Fox Command came around, too few people were interested.  And me, I don't even like Star Fox 64.

Almost all the old fans are gone, it makes me rather sad too. I enjoyed their company in my early days of the fandom. As for the games, Adventures was good on the surface but shallow. Assault was just thrown together garage. Command tried to put the pieces back together but really didn't have anything to work with. I remember though, the excitement that abounded when SFA was announced. Ah well.

So what has been keeping my renewed interest alive?  Because Star Fox characters remain consistently well-liked by the gay furry community - which is where I spend most of my time.  And I've found tons of new good fanart (mostly out of Japan), and most of it is very gay.  I keep hoping - surely, the gay fans are here on SFO, if I just keep looking for them.  And I've found a tiny few.  But for the most part, all the gay fans I know are either (1) Japanese, or (2) won't go outside FurAffinity.  They don't really think much of places like SFO.  The old fans I contacted from the MouthOff/Papetoon days - they mostly don't think much of places like SFO either.

Dermot. I like you. You're a cool dude (mostly). You seem to be smart, so let me ask you this: would it be wise for someone to base their entire interest in a series, story, or franchise, on heterosexual character relationships alone? Of course not (looking at you Krystal fantards). Your entire interest is based in the sexuality of characters who pretty much HAVE no sexuality. At the risk of sounding like a total jerk, I must say that is entirely idiotic of you. You are just like a Krystal fanboy, only instead of singing to the tune of a sex symbol, you are singing to the tune of the sexuality of characters. Its every bit as shallow.

Like I said, you're smarter than that.

So really, what are my activities here?  For the most part, I...make random comments, or start some polls, or post random fanart threads, or maintain my ever-more-elaborate signature, and I was also here to announce a new MIDI, and I even made an honest-to-goodness fanwork that ended up making so many people uncomfortable it was moved to the mature board.  But really, what else was there than that?  I still risk getting my head bitten off if I talk about the real source of my renewed interest.  Yesterday, when I posted (with permission) part of a chat log as a cultural snapshot of the gay Star Fox fandom, it almost ignited a flamewar!  I just about snapped, and wanted to smack anyone who wouldn't take my fan impetus seriously.  Star Fox is one of my gay interests - and I miss my gay friends being around to talk about my interests with.  Even the fans who really like Star Fox don't want to come here.

Comments are always welcome. Fanart is too, especially because you provide a diverse selection of it. Your MIDI work is rather good, and I enjoy your musical knowledge, as its quite uncommon to see. What you contribute to the community is a point of view, one unlike many others. This in itself is valuble. I can see why you are alone, but I can not really sympathize with it, because it just comes across as shallow.

So...I'm fan-lonely.  Very, very fan-lonely.  What exactly about SFO is so undesirable and radioactive to my friends?  And why does my fan interest have to be so repulsive to anyone here to the point of ripping my head off or trying to drive me out?  I want to feel more than just liked or invited.  I want to...fit in...and just as much, I want a place I'll fit into.  I've been a big Star Fox fan for more than half my life, and I'm just not feeling that rosy communal feeling lately.  I feel burned out.

Its not undesirable or radioactive. They just don't care. Your interest alone is not "repulsive", its the fact its your ONLY interest. Its just like 90% of the morons I have to deal with who come to the KLA. Forget about fitting in. Fitting in is for squares. You are a damn circle peg, and you are gonna not take anyone else's shit about fitting into the square hole. Hell, that's how I roll. You think I fit in, with my constant debate and drawn out discussions, walls of text, near troll like attitude, aggresive personality, antifanboyism, bigass ego, and decidedly oldfan faggotry? Hell no I don't. I don't fit in, but, I DO get along (mostly). There's a difference. You don't got to fit in, Dermot. Just get along, by expanding your interests, and what have you.

And hey, if all else fails, I always can use another wingman.

[Dermot]

(lots of stuff)

I think I'm depressed again. :(

[rebel_gunman]

I think I tactful aproach might have been better...

["User"]

I think I'm depressed again.

Try not to be and take what he says to heart.  Knowing Robert for the last couple of years I agree with everything he said.  And I, as your friend, would strongly consider taking his advice and go about this a different way.  I like you as well Dermot from a personality standpoint, but you'd be MUCH more fun to talk with if, on msn for example, you don't just discuss things that are or eventually turn into sexuality.  It gets old really fast and I have a tendency to tune you out.

[Dermot]

...  Hell no.

[Sideways]

My thoughts on the issues of late are unclear.

[Dermot]

I think this is what a broken base is all about.  People can have diametrically different reasons for being fans.  Me, I like the soap opera element of a video game with cartoon animals in space ships.

There is no way in hell I'm going to abandon my fan impetus, or apologize for it, or stop actively having it.  It's a discussion that shouldn't even be happening.  Yes, yes, I know, this sounds just like the Krystal debate...yes, I see the irony.  That's probably the only reason I figured out how to tolerate her.

[Guest DRL]

Like I said, if you feel like 'there is no one

to talk about it', you can allways bring in

some friends. Fans of all kinds are accepted

and they will be accepted too. Seeing that you

want to talk about a specific topic and can not

find someone to agree with, I think this is a fairly good

solution, bringing more people to the site and having

someone to back your views as well.

And still, it is a very nice community; nobody is

annoyed or anything at you, so no reason to find yourself

sad about that. Really, we are all for Star Fox  .

[Kursed]

Do what you feel is best Dermont...that's all I can say.honestlY i may be wiereded out ,by Gay and lesbian stuff ,but I'm not going to harras or push you away for it it's just something I'm not use to. Change Brings fear..

[Dermot]

Well, I can understand that (DRL and Kursed) a whole lot better. XD

[Robert Monroe]

I think I'm depressed again.

Part of me feels you didn't read my post.

Part of me feels you misunderstood my post.

and part of me still feels like the Scout.

So which is it? I was, beleive it or not, trying to be helpful.

[Dermot]

Part of me feels you didn't read my post.

Part of me feels you misunderstood my post.

and part of me still feels like the Scout.

So which is it? I was, beleive it or not, trying to be helpful.

I read your post.  I read all of it.  It was just very, very cruel of you.  And yes, I know you're trying to help, and I appreciate the desire.  But it's just more complex than that.