Open thread on staff improvements

[Steve]

Said individuals should really be posting their complaints in this thread instead of other places on the Internet.

That's true, but some people never learn. Instead, using weak methods such as defamation or spreading lies are just really , really low. Some guys should really man up, and say what they think here, that's the only way we can reach on agreements.

[Fluxy]

Okay, I'll be one to say it. Usually I am not the one to stick my neck out for voicing my opinion, but here it goes. Like others, just I haven't shown it really, I have issues with all the people arguing, putting others down, and just being ass holes in general. I am not gonna name people right here, but I do have a list of people I personally have been seeing act in said way for quite some time, and have not seen many (or any at all) things done about it. Sure, most of the people aren't jerks all the time, but 85%-90% is still a whole lot. And if stuff is being done about it, I would like either to see some evident change in the said peoples behavior, and (but not a necessity) some Admin/Mod confirmation that it is being worked on. In my opinion, even if an admin/mod says someone is making a valid point, or is correct about something, but that person is being very rude and argumentative about it, The said admin/mod still needs to step in and say "You need to work on responding a LOT nicer". Not many times has it happened to me, but when it does, I don't like the feeling of that rudeness directed towards me, and I see others who might get this on more of an occasion than I. I know there are others out there who feel either the same, or very dang close to it as I do.

My point in a bundle, I would like to see staff buckle down more on attitudes around here. And i know not every little detail can be picked at, some will fly under their nose, and I get that. But  really. Even Julius, a mod, is feeling some affect from it. That should be a big sign this crap really needs to be worked on. Not everyone can be a macho man about people being complete jerk off's, cause I know I sure as hell can't. If what I am hearing is correct, and this is meant to be a comfortable environment for all users, that means the bad attitudes also need to be looked at for those like me. I am tired of seeing 1-2 people leave practically a week from idiots who are arguing and getting personal on a topic.

[Ris Grestar]

That's true, but some people never learn. Instead, using weak methods such as defamation or spreading lies are just really , really low. Some guys should really man up, and say what they think here, that's the only way we can reach on agreements.

You're right, some people never learn.  That goes for both normal members and members of the moderation team.

[Guest DRL]

Well, I know you are [may] not

reffering to me, but when I make

a wrong move, I apologize for it.

It happened, for example, in the

Pub, where I over-reacted and

Julius thought I was ridiculizing him

(which I was not).

I allways apologize when I make a mistake,

and do so in PM's if necesary. It is just something

I allways do (if, of course, what I said can be

offensive. Otherwise I can also explain it so

it is no longer looked as offensive.)

My point is that some people like debating stuff,

but they do not allways do so in the right way.

[Steve]

You're right, some people never learn.  That goes for both normal members and members of the moderation team.

Indeed  , but remember, can't please everyone.

[Ris Grestar]

Indeed  , but remember, can't please everyone.

Of course.  I'm just glad you can simply play it off with a razzberry.  ^^

["User"]

Okay, I'll be one to say it. Usually I am not the one to stick my neck out for voicing my opinion, but here it goes. Like others, just I haven't shown it really, I have issues with all the people arguing, putting others down, and just being ass holes in general.

Agreed.  I'm concerned about that as well.

I am not gonna name people right here, but I do have a list of people I personally have been seeing act in said way for quite some time, and have not seen many (or any at all) things done about it. Sure, most of the people aren't jerks all the time, but 85%-90% is still a whole lot. And if stuff is being done about it, I would like either to see some evident change in the said peoples behavior, and (but not a necessity) some Admin/Mod confirmation that it is being worked on.

So enforce the rules more diligently then to cut back on abrasive behavior?  That's plausible.

In my opinion, even if an admin/mod says someone is making a valid point, or is correct about something, but that person is being very rude and argumentative about it, The said admin/mod still needs to step in and say "You need to work on responding a LOT nicer". Not many times has it happened to me, but when it does, I don't like the feeling of that rudeness directed towards me, and I see others who might get this on more of an occasion than I. I know there are others out there who feel either the same, or very dang close to it as I do.

While this can be true a lot of the time there are also other examples where one person has a valid point, brings proof to back up his logical claim, AND is being polite but the other person (for immaturity reasons or seeing an answer he doesn't agree with) instigates the drama by bringing BS logic into the argument that not only makes him look silly but starts an argument where neither side will back down.  I can understand trying to be nice and patient with someone while debunking their claims but really...if the person doesn't "accept defeat" because it's obvious to everyone they are wrong and continue to make himself look like more of an ass wouldn't you lose your patience/temper as well quite easily?  Some people do, some people don't.  Your suggestion is workable for sure though.

My point in a bundle, I would like to see staff buckle down more on attitudes around here. And i know not every little detail can be picked at, some will fly under their nose, and I get that. But  really. Even Julius, a mod, is feeling some affect from it. That should be a big sign this crap really needs to be worked on. Not everyone can be a macho man about people being complete jerk off's, cause I know I sure as hell can't. If what I am hearing is correct, and this is meant to be a comfortable environment for all users, that means the bad attitudes also need to be looked at for those like me. I am tired of seeing 1-2 people leave practically a week from idiots who are arguing and getting personal on a topic.

I concur with that point and I can safely say that the rest of the SFO staff and admins are feeling the same way with regards to attitudes among certain people and more topics appearing that hint of "spamminess".  This is something that needs to be addressed.

[Sapphire]

People just need to accept defeat when they're wrong.

Admins/Mods should ALWAYS be respected.

AND

People need to leave the drama at home :facepalm:

[Ris Grestar]

Admins/Mods should ALWAYS be respected.

I have to disagree.  I personally feel that people should be respected if they are deserving of the respect, you know?

[Sapphire]

I have to disagree.  I personally feel that people should be respected if they are deserving of the respect, you know?

Yeah, and knowing that they are actually staff of the wonderful forum/site you're on should be a good enough reason for respect.

I respect them all :P

["User"]

People just need to accept defeat when they're wrong.

Admins/Mods should ALWAYS be respected.

AND

People need to leave the drama at home

I feel that they should be respected for the work and dedication they put into their sites.  Some of them spend a large amount of time on the forums they run.

However I also feel that respect is something that is earned, but that is more of a "personal" respect.  I can respect the head admin of the main Laser Quest players forum for all the work he does maintaining that site even if I don't personally respect him because of his attitude, etc.

[Ris Grestar]

Yeah, and knowing that they are actually staff of the wonderful forum/site you're on should be a good enough reason for respect.

I respect them all

I'll respect your respect as I respect my own.  To me, titles are titles.  Actions and words are what make the biggest difference.

[Fluxy]

I have to disagree.  I personally feel that people should be respected if they are deserving of the respect, you know?

I agree with your disagreement. I too feel that everyone, including admin's and mod's need to earn respect just like every member here. Not to say most haven't earned theirs though, just stating an "In general" sorta thing.

[Guest DRL]

I agree with your disagreement. I too feel that everyone, including admin's and mod's need to earn respect just like every member here. Not to say most haven't earned theirs though, just stating an "In general" sorta thing.

I agree with your agreement

on his disagreement... Uh,

were where we?

(Joking! )

But seriously, I agree.

[Sapphire]

I feel that they should be respected for the work and dedication they put into their sites.  Some of them spend a large amount of time on the forums they run.

However I also feel that respect is something that is earned, but that is more of a "personal" respect.  I can respect the head admin of the main Laser Quest players forum for all the work he does maintaining that site even if I don't personally respect him because of his attitude, etc.

Thanks you User!

That;s what I was trying to say....maybe we should start a poll?

[Steve]

Again ,it's not simple.  This forum has never had problems until this year, and it's pretty much because the community is growing up too fast, so really, pleasing every single member is going to be impossible, which is why when I get ONE single person telling me "why did you lock this topic? you didn't have any reason to do so" or anything like that, I personally won't spend more than 2 pms explaining myself. Specially when my fellow community and staff agree with me, if I get more than one person complaining about my moding actions, then sure, let's sit down, and discuss about it.

Some guys just like to view the bad side of the story, and that really pisses me off, it really makes me go "why am I even freaking trying?" For once, I wish SOME of you would be on DZ's shoes, or heck, even mine, taking care of a site like this, with so many things to consider, is NOT easy, specially after losing one of the best damn admins out there. We are freaking giving up our free time, and DZ is giving even more than that, to make this place as shiny as it can get.

Instead of solving the problem, why not doing something like Nick did?, he stated  his point of view, and it's a darn well point of view, and thanks to him, we are addressing the situation on the staff board and we are trying to compromise to get the best solution possible, without damaging anything or anyone. I just hope that some people (you know dang well who you are) would simply speak up instead of hiding in the shadows. If at the end, you don't like the site or the staff or if you think you can do a better job, then leave or make your own freaking forum, because we seriously have more important things than dealing with stupid disagreements that could've been fixed with some chitty chat.

"The admin/mod/user is ticking me off, so I must leave the site and post my rants somewhere else" is not the damn solution.

/rant over

[Guest Julius Quasar]

Some people felt the were being ignored, though...or like they were being told "STFU".

[Steve]

Some people felt the were being ignored, though...or like they were being told "STFU".

Try handling more than one big drama at the same time, while dealing with finals (DZ) and enjoying your only free timeofn the year (me). We have full mods for a reason, if the full mods are not available for a while (we have 4 now, so this excuse should be rarely used), then the admins will come to the rescue, but it seems that no one remembers that  . Remember, mods are the first line of defense, not the admins. If a mod made a bad call, then sure, throw the pm at ME, if I'm not available or if I'm not answering, then go for DZ. Our inboxes are already full as it is. This place was organized by three admins, now we are only two, so we are both doing the best we can, with the limitations we have. Just remember, first mods, then steve, then DZ (unless DZ goes "hey, I have lots of free time!"). Let's remember that he deals with the hardest job, which is keeping this place bug free and updated; among other things.

However, if it's a personal thing, like, let's say, complains about my or DZ's moding activities, then sure, address us, however, don't expect a whooping conversation or an instant pm, at least if we know we are right.

[Geo Stelar]

I have to disagree.  I personally feel that people should be respected if they are deserving of the respect, you know?

I agree

People earn respect as they progress. People will forget the good deeds you have done easier than they can forget the wrong things you've done.

On my part, I have no complaints regarding staff members.

However, I will complain if ever one of them is going to resign the staff job just for not enough understandable reason!!

I have friends here on SF-O. Maybe we haven't met personally, but having friends here is enough to keep me in here. In this wonderful, excellent forum.

DZ, Steve, Asper, "User", Sissi, The Dark Knight, Julius Quasar, even the previous admin Mr. K, you all rock! (I feel I forget someone...)

Trollers and wrongdoers better beware...

[fox1235]

DZ, Steve, Asper, "User", Sissi, The Dark Knight, Julius Quasar, even the previous admin Mr. K, you all rock! (I feel I forget someone...)

What about Four-Eyed Vulpine the person who keeps the main site updated and One Winged Angel the person who runs are game servers.

[Sapphire]

Again ,it's not simple.  This forum has never had problems until this year, and it's pretty much because the community is growing up too fast, so really, pleasing every single member is going to be impossible, which is why when I get ONE single person telling me "why did you lock this topic? you didn't have any reason to do so" or anything like that, I personally won't spend more than 2 pms explaining myself. Specially when my fellow community and staff agree with me, if I get more than one person complaining about my moding actions, then sure, let's sit down, and discuss about it.

Some guys just like to view the bad side of the story, and that really pisses me off, it really makes me go "why am I even freaking trying?" For once, I wish SOME of you would be on DZ's shoes, or heck, even mine, taking care of a site like this, with so many things to consider, is NOT easy, specially after losing one of the best damn admins out there. We are freaking giving up our free time, and DZ is giving even more than that, to make this place as shiny as it can get.

Instead of solving the problem, why not doing something like Nick did?, he stated  his point of view, and it's a darn well point of view, and thanks to him, we are addressing the situation on the staff board and we are trying to compromise to get the best solution possible, without damaging anything or anyone. I just hope that some people (you know dang well who you are) would simply speak up instead of hiding in the shadows. If at the end, you don't like the site or the staff or if you think you can do a better job, then leave or make your own freaking forum, because we seriously have more important things than dealing with stupid disagreements that could've been fixed with some chitty chat.

"The admin/mod/user is ticking me off, so I must leave the site and post my rants somewhere else" is not the damn solution.

/rant over

I'm completely with you on this Steve.

Not only do you Admins keep this site/forum up and running and good shape. But you guys have to put up with all of this member drama BS or whatever you wanna call it. You guys need a break.

[Asper Sarnoff]

I have to disagree.  I personally feel that people should be respected if they are deserving of the respect, you know?

Are you implying that you somehow feel one or more of the staff-members have acted in ways that means they shouldn't be worthy of your respect? If so, I'd really like to hear it said openly to my face, instead of having to hear it secondhand that someone have been backtalking me or the other members of the staff, which have and still do put a lot of their time and effort into protecting and serving the members of SF-O.

[Sapphire]

which have and still do put a lot of their time and effort into protecting and serving the members of SF-O.

Another good reason why everybody should respect the Staff of SFO.  :wink:

[Avaika]

You know you guys... even though I'm not involved, and will never be involved, this situation is ticking me off more and more by the minute, just saying. And remember, I said I was sitting out.  :evil:

[Sapphire]

You know you guys... even though I'm not involved, and will never be involved, this situation is ticking me off more and more by the minute, just saying. And remember, I said I was sitting out. 

If you don't wanna be involved, then don't post here. Just saying.