The eyes are windows...

[Sabre]

Fun fact: I fvcking love science, am aiming for a medical degree, and find people who ignore science to be completely irritating. The beleif in the supernatural is NOT mutually exclusive of beleiving in the scientific. The scientific is there to explain how the world works, how things function, how what is became what is, and where it will go. The supernatural, the beleif and faith in what is supposedly beyond our scope of comprehension, isn't even in the same ball park. It is a form of philosophy. Your claims of time travel and imps are not. They are incredibly obvious low blows to people with metaphysical beleifs, and they are very much strawman. Its not elitism, although I can see how many with such beleifs can be elitist. They are, however, no more elitist that people like you who instead of sharing science with people in a peaceable and compatible way, just go "BOOOO YOU SO STUPID", beratting them over the head because they happen to have beleifs that YOU DON'T SHARE, that aren't even RELATED to science, thinking them to be some sort of backwards troglodyte simply on the basis of their beleifs.

People who are ignorant of how the world works (science) make me sick, but people that do what you do make me equally sick.

Actually, elitism is this: Elitism is the belief or attitude that some individuals, who supposedly form an elite — a select group of people with, intellect, wealth, specialized training or experience, or other distinctive attributes — are those whose views on a matter are to be taken the most seriously or carry the most weight or those who view their own views as so; whose views and/or actions are most likely to be constructive to society as a whole; or whose extraordinary skills, abilities or wisdom render them especially fit to govern.

In other words, its thinking you are better than other people. It has NOTHING to do with what you want to beleive spiritually. It has NOTHING to do with the common held feelings on the sacrity of life. And while spritual people can be elitist (such as discriminitory religious groups), these beleifs in and of themself are not elitist in the slightest.

I disagree on spirituallity being philosaphical. It isn't. The only difference between the imp idea and the spirit idea is that spirits are widely accepted, imps are not. As such I don't think it's a low blow. The issue is that if you interchange something that is similar it becomes rediculous, so people have to special plead there way out.

Elitism as applied to people is how you describe. Currently there is no one word for "Thinks is better then a brick" so we have to make do. Maybe narsasissim would be a better word, but I can't spell it.

[Robert Monroe]

I disagree on spirituallity being philosaphical. It isn't. The only difference between the imp idea and the spirit idea is that spirits are widely accepted, imps are not. As such I don't think it's a low blow. The issue is that if you interchange something that is similar it becomes rediculous, so people have to special plead there way out.

Elitism as applied to people is how you describe. Currently there is no one word for "Thinks is better then a brick" so we have to make do. Maybe narsasissim would be a better word, but I can't spell it.

Philosophy is defined as Philosophy is the study of general and fundamental problems concerning matters such as existence, knowledge, values, reason, mind, and language.

In other words, it deals with shit that can not be proven with facts. Its a whole lot of opinions and personal beleifs. Now granted, most philosophy is rational or based in logic, but the keyword there is MOST. There ARE spiritual philosophies (hi Buddhism), and by extension you could very well call religion theological philosophy. Your imp idea is strawman, and that is it. There is no thought or theory behind it, its just something you pulled out of your ass to make a poorly structured point.

Narcissism is defined as the personality trait of egotism, vanity, conceit, or simple selfishness. Its an individual personality trait, not quite in the same boat as elitism (which is a social behavior), and either way thinking you are better than a BRICK is neither of those. There is a difference between thinking you are better than a damn rock, better than other living being (which can be elitist to a degree depening on how you go about it), and thinking you are better than your peers. The notion, for example, that humans are better than nature, is elitist. The notion that one social group of people is better than another is elitist. Thinking human lives (or really most any life) is more valuble than a damn stick in the mud is not elitist. Your extreme misanthropy has caused you to paint words to fit your own definitions, and use that to attack other people. Nothing more.

[Sabre]

There is no thought or theory behind it, its just something you pulled out of your ass to make a poorly structured point.

Oddly enough, that's how I see souls, religion, spirituality, ect.

"Do everything this way because ...invisable sky man said so. Yeah, that'll do. Now don't worry about dying because ...you have a intangable thing that will live on after death, you can't see it though. Also mental health issues completly destroy that idea. Just don't mention it and it will be cool."

Philosophy is defined as Philosophy is the study of general and fundamental problems concerning matters such as existence, knowledge, values, reason, mind, and language.

No where in that definition does it say "making up crap".

Well then Mr thesaurus. What word would YOU use? Since we have to be very very strict about the exact meaning of a word even if it's usage in context is obvious.

Nice assumption that I hate all people. I only hate the ones who are beyond reason. I would "or stupid" to that, but given that is technically a medical condition I can't use it, even with context. You see how hard this make's comunication? That's a rhetorical question btw.

[Robert Monroe]

Oddly enough, that's how I see souls, religion, spirituality, ect.

"Do everything this way because ...invisable sky man said so. Yeah, that'll do. Now don't worry about dying because ...you have a intangable thing that will live on after death, you can't see it though. Also mental health issues completly destroy that idea. Just don't mention it and it will be cool."

No where in that definition does it say "making up crap".

Well then Mr thesaurus. What word would YOU use? Since we have to be very very strict about the exact meaning of a word even if it's usage in context is obvious.

Nice assumption that I hate all people. I only hate the ones who are beyond reason. I would "or stupid" to that, but given that is technically a medical condition I can't use it, even with context. You see how hard this make's comunication? That's a rhetorical question btw.

Get out more then. Study these religions. You really think Buddhism, Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, and whatever else just pulled shit out of their ass? No, they didn't, and they have had thousands of years of change and development and educated philosophy behind them. There are intricate details to these philosophical beleifs, on the nature of man, the nature of humanity, and how we should live our lives. It goes much further than "invisble sky man".

And all philosophy IS, is makng up "crap". Its all someone else's THEORY on how and why THEY think the world spins. None of them are FACTUAL, they are all individual beleifs and truths.

And its not an assumption that you hate people. You have "anti-human" in your little text there, and have time and time again shown to not give a single fvck about humanity as a whole. That is textbook misanthropy.... although I never said you hated ALL people. I said your misanthropy (which you have) has caused you to paint personalized definitions of words to your own meanings, and then you use them to bitch at people. Which you do.

[Sabre]

Get out more then. Study these religions. You really think Buddhism, Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, and whatever else just pulled shit out of their ass? No, they didn't, and they have had thousands of years of change and development and educated philosophy behind them. There are intricate details to these philosophical beleifs, on the nature of man, the nature of humanity, and how we should live our lives. It goes much further than "invisble sky man".

For example?

And its not an assumption that you hate people. You have "anti-human" in your little text there, and have time and time again shown to not give a single fvck about humanity as a whole. That is textbook misanthropy.... although I never said you hated ALL people. I said your misanthropy (which you have) has caused you to paint personalized definitions of words to your own meanings, and then you use them to bitch at people. Which you do.

Th anti human thing is a double meaning actually. There is the meaning you describe, and the meaning in the sence of army units, eg. Anti Aircraft Gun. Even so, I don't really believe I am a Sledge Hammer. The part of that little text you chose to quote mine. Again, we can tachnically go on and on about what is technically a quote, and grammer, but it's just a poorly disguised attempt to dodge the real issue is that soul doesn't exsist. If it does exsist, it's not doing anything usful, and the reason for it's belief is the false idea of -insert word I would be allowed to use to describe "thinking you have more worth then something" yet you stubbonly refused to provide-.

Not to mention that fact being misanthropic doesn't mean I'm wrong. You simply want to dodge the issue because YOU HAVE NO ANSWER. You keep trying to derail the thread because you have no lagitimate defence.

[Milkyway64]

In his defense, you have no legitimate offense either, Sabre.

[Sabre]

True, but then occam's razor is in effect.

"[occam's razor] states that when answering a problem or searching for a cause for something, one should never make more assumptions or posit more causes than the minimum necessary to solve the problem."

In other words, you have no evidence for a thing that for practical purposes doesn't exsist. Therefore it doesn't exsist. End of scrpit.

Before you go citing dark matter, it does serve a purpose, explaining gravational annomallies that seem to show mass is there, but beyond our ability to detect. Either it does exsist and we don't have the tools to see it yet, or our maths is wrong. Either way, it's purpose is to balence the books until we can work out what's going on. The soul has no such claim.

Second, "god/aliens/burt raynolds did it" is not occams razor, that's making up crap.

[Guest Julius Quasar]

*eats popcorn and enjoys watching/reading the arguments*    :lol:

[Fira-Astrali]

*eats popcorn and enjoys watching/reading the arguments*   

iknorite? i wanted to interject but i dont wanna break anybody's train of thought :P

[Redeemer]

On topic guys, jeez:

My soul is also telling me to observe. :P

["User"]

I've been keeping an eye on this thread, but it's pretty much Sabre vs Robert Monroe and everyone else.  It's a pretty lopsided argument in my books

[Guest Julius Quasar]

iknorite? i wanted to interject but i dont wanna break anybody's train of thought

(couldn't resist) 

as for a soul, I believe in their existence, I believe there is more to our existence after death, not necessarily in a "Beetlejuice" way (that would be awesome though) , but, you know, afterlife and such.

A soul does exist, as I said before, you are a soul...we are souls.

[Sabre]

I've been keeping an eye on this thread, but it's pretty much Sabre vs Robert Monroe and everyone else.  It's a pretty lopsided argument in my books

-and I still come out on top. Ah ha!

But, if you would rather I left you alone to talk about magical crap as if it's real, I'll leave you to it. I can drop by later and mark everyone as denying reality thus losing any respect I had for you assuming I had some to begin with.

[Milkyway64]

-and I still come out on top. Ah ha!

But, if you would rather I left you alone to talk about magical crap as if it's real, I'll leave you to it. I can drop by later and mark everyone as denying reality thus losing any respect I had for you assuming I had some to begin with.

With what proof, other than just being a douchebag? It goes in circles. They can't prove their "magical crap" and you can't offer a better explanation for it, either. Both sides are at a stalemate here and just assuming your claim is right makes you as big a twat as the others.

[Robert Monroe]

Sabre, you are being a pigheaded twat.

Again, we can tachnically go on and on about what is technically a quote, and grammer, but it's just a poorly disguised attempt to dodge the real issue is that soul doesn't exsist. If it does exsist, it's not doing anything usful, and the reason for it's belief is the false idea of -insert word I would be allowed to use to describe "thinking you have more worth then something" yet you stubbonly refused to provide-.

Not to mention that fact being misanthropic doesn't mean I'm wrong. You simply want to dodge the issue because YOU HAVE NO ANSWER. You keep trying to derail the thread because you have no lagitimate defence.

Except there's a few things wrong here.

1: I NEVER originally was debating the "existence" of the soul, because I'm smart enough to know that trying to debate shit that relies entirely on personal philosophical beleifs gets you NOWHERE. I was simply pointing out that you were being a fat-headed jerkass whose arguements were full of holes, using your own personal point of view to paint the topics the way you want to see them instead of viewing them from an objective point of view. So yeah, I was never debating the existence of the soul in the first place, I was just putting your ass in line.

2: You make the bold claim that the soul DOESN'T exist. To this I must say PROVE it. Its one thing to say you don't BELEIVE the soul exists, that is your personal beleifs, and noone is going to challenge it. You are obligated to having it. But, to say that the soul doesn't exist as if it were FACT, when philosophy and spirituality are rooted in FAITH and BELEIFS, not fact, and can never be "proven", you are making quite the arrogant claim. So I say to you, mighty and wise Sabre, damn PROVE your claims. A hard, factual, scientific debunk to the existence of the soul. Until then, shut the hell up.

[Sabre]

With what proof, other than just being a douchebag? It goes in circles. They can't prove their "magical crap" and you can't offer a better explanation for it, either. Both sides are at a stalemate here and just assuming your claim is right makes you as big a twat as the others.

No, I'm logically in the right. I can't offer a 'better explanation' because there is nothing to explain. I have already explained this point enough. You can't just make up crap and claim that it's real just because you make it 'science proof'.

There is an excersise called "Dragon in My Garage" which is demostrates how crazy these ideas are. It goes like this.

-If you claim there is a soul (in this case, make it god, brian blessed, whatever magical thing you like) then you must also accept I have a pet dragon. (or as I said earlier, the human body is controled by imps)

-If you then say "That's stupid because X" (like robert did by going on about philosaphy) then I can throw that same quetion back at you, and hand wave it same way.

You can read it more here

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/The_Dragon_in_My_Garage

Sabre, you are being a pigheaded twat.

Except there's a few things wrong here.

1: I NEVER originally was debating the "existence" of the soul, because I'm smart enough to know that trying to debate shit that relies entirely on personal philosophical beleifs gets you NOWHERE. I was simply pointing out that you were being a fat-headed jerkass whose arguements were full of holes, using your own personal point of view to paint the topics the way you want to see them instead of viewing them from an objective point of view. So yeah, I was never debating the existence of the soul in the first place, I was just putting your ass in line.

2: You make the bold claim that the soul DOESN'T exist. To this I must say PROVE it. Its one thing to say you don't BELEIVE the soul exists, that is your personal beleifs, and noone is going to challenge it. You are obligated to having it. But, to say that the soul doesn't exist as if it were FACT, when philosophy and spirituality are rooted in FAITH and BELEIFS, not fact, and can never be "proven", you are making quite the arrogant claim. So I say to you, mighty and wise Sabre, damn PROVE your claims. A hard, factual, scientific debunk to the existence of the soul. Until then, shut the hell up.

I'm not making the claim it exsists, the burden of proof is on you. Also you claim my argument is full of holes, but you have yet to make any stick. When you stop being a baby spitting your dummy out, then we can talk like grown ups.

[Robert Monroe]

No, I'm logically in the right. I can't offer a 'better explanation' because there is nothing to explain. I have already explained this point enough. You can't just make up crap and claim that it's real just because you make it 'science proof'.

There is an excersise called "Dragon in My Garage" which is demostrates how crazy these ideas are. It goes like this.

-If you claim there is a soul (in this case, make it god, brian blessed, whatever magical thing you like) then you must also accept I have a pet dragon. (or as I said earlier, the human body is controled by imps)

-If you then say "That's stupid because X" (like robert did by going on about philosaphy) then I can throw that same quetion back at you, and hand wave it same way.

Following an accepted, time-tested spiritual philosophy is not the same thing as saying HURR I HAVE A DRAGON. The common sense factor is here, where we can discern between a practitioner of a spiritual, philosophical beleif, and someone who is making shit up. Now, if you can show me a time-tested, respected philosophy based on  Garage Dragons/Brian Blessed/Imps, I will gladly eat my hat.

I'm not making the claim it exsists, the burden of proof is on you. Also you claim my argument is full of holes, but you have yet to make any stick. When you stop being a baby spitting your dummy out, then we can talk like grown ups.

Burden of proof is not on me because I'M NOT DEBATING THE EXISTENCE OF THE SOUL. -YOU-, however, ARE. I am debating your piss poor excuse of a debate form, with its pompous assumptions, condescending attitude, and general "greater than thou" attitude. I AM talking like an adult, you however are the equivilent of a snot-nosed teenager who thinks he knows how the world turns and is calling everyone who doesnt agree with him stupid. I don't CARE what you beleive, I don't care WHY you believe it. I care that you stop being a HUMONGOUS DICK and learn to debate and discuss objectively. That smack talk you said about elitism? You are doing just that, thinking yourself to be higher than those around you because you don't agree with you. Just like those who ostriscize those who don't beleive in souls, or a god, or Brian Blessed, you too have put yourself on some damn pedastle, and demeaning those who do not think like you do. This is fact. This is truth. You are a hypocrite of the highest order.

["User"]

-and I still come out on top. Ah ha!

Quite the opposite actually, everyone here except you I'm very sure would see your losing this argument.  There has been no one else in this thread who is backing you up on any of your points.

Follow the rules for effectively debating here, or don't debate at all.

[Sabre]

I didn't read the bottom half as you started name calling again.

As to the dragon theory being old, give me 2 thousands years and I'll get back to you ...oh, wait, we won't be alive then.

Following an accepted, time-tested spiritual philosophy is not the same thing as saying HURR I HAVE A DRAGON.

Yes it is.

Quite the opposite actually, everyone here except you I'm very sure would see your losing this argument.  There has been no one else in this thread who is backing you up on any of your points.

Follow the rules for effectively debating here, or don't debate at all.

I am following the rules. Go back a read the previous posts with an unbiased oppinion, and you will see that I'm not the one throwing around insults, dodging the issue and throwing tantrums like a child.

Also truth is not a popularity contest.

["User"]

I am following the rules. Go back a read the previous posts with an unbiased oppinion, and you will see that I'm not the one throwing around names and throwing tantrums like a child.

I've read the entire topic with an unbiased opinion here (which is pretty much originally what Robert was doing as well) and from what I've see you just "aren't getting it" (personal opinion of course).  Of course now you're going to say that my opinion is bias because it doesn't agree with yours and hence is not "objective".  Robert wasn't trying to prove a point, he was originally arguing from an objective point of view, basically saying that trying to prove or disapprove a soul existing as FACT is really not possible given that science (which is the pursuit of knowledge developed by man) can't do sh*t when it comes to the super natural .  It's one of those things that humanity might never ever discover the objective truth to.  The burden of proof actually *IS* on you to disprove the souls existence because like Robert say he wasn't trying to prove anything here either way.  Robert isn't dodging any issue here. 

Furthermore you don't know Robert, whereas I do (for over two years) and he doesn't seriously "throw around tantrums". It may seem that way online but the only time he might hint at doing so (and sarcastically insult people) is when his opponent is not doing anything to further prove this point. You see this when he used to argue with Krystal fanboys when he first signed up here. 

Sabre, your entitled to your pessimistic anti-religious attitudes on SFO but really now...just remember that any thread that becomes repetitive (same arguments over and over) is considered finished and will be locked.  If I don't see any "productivity" in this debate while insults and sarcastic remarks increase then I'm going to lock this topic - this goes for both of you.  Play nice.

[Sabre]

Not my fault. There is nothing I can do. He believes in magic and refuses to listen to logic or reason, instead twisting it to fit his own make believe crap. He can shift the burden of proof, hand wave, or claim whatever he likes. The fact remains that the soul does not exsist. It serves no purpose, and thus has no reason to exsist. He has 3 realistic options.

1- Revise his beliefs in the face of logic and reason.

2- Admit that he believes fairy tale crap.

those 2 won't happen because he is invested and has issues with being seen as 'wrong'. He must appear to wise in all things at all times.

That leaves option 3- prove it. Unfortunatly for him his 'proof' is just hand waves and bullshit. There are loads of examples of those who have tried, and failed, and yet he persists.

The thread is "Do you believe in a soul?" and the answer is "no, here's an exhausetive list why". Fira asked because she had never questioned it. She has little or no sceptical tools or the will to use them. Unfortunatly we have captain magic here spreading his gospal of sick. I have no issue with his crazy magic man belief, but the thread is about questioning something that doesn't exsist purly because you had no reason to doubt it. I see as important, not to mention morally right to educate.

Logic and reason. That is all that matters. People will trick you and lie to you every single day and so you need to know this stuff. You might like it, you might not want to hear it, but Robert is Wrong. You are Wrong. Just look at the Cargo Cult. Is that the future you want? Idiots who do not question, who rely on blind faith and instict? You HAVE to question everything.

Who, What, Where, When, Why, How. These are what you have to ask. You have to be aware of how you can cock up so you don't fall into the same trap, and you to get over your own ego and admit "I was wrong, I believed crap".

You're going to laugh me out of the thread, if not the forum, but before I started being sceptical (that sceptical, not a nay sayer) you want to know what I believed? I believed the law of attraction. If you're to lazy to look it up, it's the belief that happy thoughts make you physically well and that good things will happen if you just believe they will. It's total bollocks, but that's what can happen if you don't demand evidence.

EDIT- For more reading on that bollocks I believed.

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Law_of_Attraction

and I fell for it like a bloody idiot.

[Robert Monroe]

Not my fault. There is nothing I can do. He believes in magic and refuses to listen to logic or reason, instead twisting it to fit his own make believe crap. He can shift the burden of proof, hand wave, or claim whatever he likes. The fact remains that the soul does not exsist. It serves no purpose, and thus has no reason to exsist. He has 3 realistic options.

1- Revise his beliefs in the face of logic and reason.

2- Admit that he believes fairy tale crap.

those 2 won't happen because he is invested and has issues with being seen as 'wrong'. He must appear to wise in all things at all times.

That leaves option 3- prove it. Unfortunatly for him his 'proof' is just hand waves and bullshit. There are loads of examples of those who have tried, and failed, and yet he persists.

The thread is "Do you believe in a soul?" and the answer is "no, here's an exhausetive list why". Fira asked because she had never questioned it. She has little or no sceptical tools or the will to use them. Unfortunatly we have captain magic here spreading his gospal of sick. I have no issue with his crazy magic man belief, but the thread is about questioning something that doesn't exsist purly because you had no reason to doubt it. I see as important, not to mention morally right to educate.

Logic and reason. That is all that matters. People will trick you and lie to you every single day and so you need to know this stuff. You might like it, you might not want to hear it, but Robert is Wrong. You are Wrong. Just look at the Cargo Cult. Is that the future you want? Idiots who do not question, who rely on blind faith and instict? You HAVE to question everything.

Who, What, Where, When, Why, How. These are what you have to ask. You have to be aware of how you can cock up so you don't fall into the same trap, and you to get over your own ego and admit "I was wrong, I believed crap".

You're going to laugh me out of the thread, if not the forum, but before I started being sceptical (that sceptical, not a nay sayer) you want to know what I believed? I believed the law of attraction. If you're to lazy to look it up, it's the belief that happy thoughts make you physically well and that good things will happen if you just believe they will. It's total bollocks, but that's what can happen if you don't demand evidence.

EDIT- For more reading on that bollocks I believed.

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Law_of_Attraction

and I fell for it like a bloody idiot.

So, because something serves no purpose, means it doesn't exist? There are many things that serve no real purpose, but exist. In fact, you see this often in biology, during he stages of evolution, as animals adapt and slowly lose useless functions, they have a little limbo period in which they still have their useless parts. That arguement is flawed.

Nextly, I -do- beleive in logic and reason. I don't blame catastophes or whatever shit I don't understand on the "will of God" or whatever the hell. I seek out facts and truths, my spiritual guidance is just that: spiritual. I don't pray for a thousand dollars, I pray for self insight on getting a good job that would let me earn a thousand dollars, for example. I am a very rational and logical person.

Thirdly, you must define "fairy tale crap". By definition, the word crap carries a negative connotation, and is not an objective description. Ergo, I can not admit to something that is not objective. I admit to beleiving in nonphysical, spiritual forces, as much as I admit to beleiving in science, logic and reason.

Fourthly, I don't have to prove a damn thing, because ONCE AGAIN, I am -not- debating the soul here. I am debating your abbrasive, offensive, insulting discussion method, which you do not seem to wrap your ego-bloated mind around the notion of. You want to start a fire over the existence of the soul? You damn well better do something to prove your claims, other than telling people how stupid they are.

Logic and reason may be all that matters to you, and that is fine and dandy, its your life choice, but do not preach it like some universal truth. To many people, myself included, there is more to life than just doing shit logically. A beleif in the human spirit, that living things are more than just machines who eat sleep and shit. This is not "wrong", this is not "right", this is a PERSONAL POINT OF VIEW, and your insistance on that it is anything more than that is pompous tomfoolery.

I'm not going to laugh you away. Being skeptical is fine. Beng a total fvcking dickhead to people, however, is not.

I didn't read the bottom half as you started name calling again.

As for this, you are in no position to speak, as you have insulted everyone else in this topic. Two wrongs don't make a right, but you can't hide behind the "boohoo name calling" wall when you have done it to so many others, including myself.

[Milkyway64]

Sabre - 0

Robert - 1

:trollface:

[Sabre]

So, because something serves no purpose, means it doesn't exist? There are many things that serve no real purpose, but exist. In fact, you see this often in biology, during he stages of evolution, as animals adapt and slowly lose useless functions, they have a little limbo period in which they still have their useless parts. That arguement is flawed.

Nextly, I -do- beleive in logic and reason. I don't blame catastophes or whatever shit I don't understand on the "will of God" or whatever the hell. I seek out facts and truths, my spiritual guidance is just that: spiritual. I don't pray for a thousand dollars, I pray for self insight on getting a good job that would let me earn a thousand dollars, for example. I am a very rational and logical person.

Thirdly, you must define "fairy tale crap". By definition, the word crap carries a negative connotation, and is not an objective description. Ergo, I can not admit to something that is not objective. I admit to beleiving in nonphysical, spiritual forces, as much as I admit to beleiving in science, logic and reason.

Fourthly, I don't have to prove a damn thing, because ONCE AGAIN, I am -not- debating the soul here. I am debating your abbrasive, offensive, insulting discussion method, which you do not seem to wrap your ego-bloated mind around the notion of. You want to start a fire over the existence of the soul? You damn well better do something to prove your claims, other than telling people how stupid they are.

Logic and reason may be all that matters to you, and that is fine and dandy, its your life choice, but do not preach it like some universal truth. To many people, myself included, there is more to life than just doing shit logically. A beleif in the human spirit, that living things are more than just machines who eat sleep and shit. This is not "wrong", this is not "right", this is a PERSONAL POINT OF VIEW, and your insistance on that it is anything more than that is pompous tomfoolery.

I'm not going to laugh you away. Being skeptical is fine. Beng a total fvcking dickhead to people, however, is not.

As for this, you are in no position to speak, as you have insulted everyone else in this topic. Two wrongs don't make a right, but you can't hide behind the "boohoo name calling" wall when you have done it to so many others, including myself.

I don't even have to reply to that, you just proved my point. Also, since you're getting the mods involved, then you clearly have no lagitimate come back. We are done here.

[Milkyway64]

I don't even have to reply to that, you just proved my point. Also, since you're getting the mods involved, then you clearly have no lagitimate come back. We are done here.

In this post: "Waaaahhh I lost so I'm going to retreat feigning victory and blaming the moderation on my opponent, who CLEARLY called them in!"

Seriously Sabre.