Disposition towards Krystal?

[Sylum]

WELLLLLLLLL this is a discussion. why don't you tell us your reasons, Zorro. :D

[Redeemer]

I don't mind her. In fact, looking at her inspires me to draw because I like pretty characters.

What I do mind are the fanboys that have somewhat warped her image and try to force others to love her as they do, as though she is the most perfect being in existence and no one is allowed to breathe otherwise. While I like Krystal's appearance, her character is lacking depth and personality, so I'd like to learn more about her. I can't just love someone unconditionally because they're attractive, that's not how I work.

[El Zorro de la Estrella]

WELLLLLLLLL this is a discussion. why don't you tell us your reasons, Zorro.

Ah, you're right lol

Well, just to get it outta the way immediatley she's beautiful.

However, I think that she added a whole nother dimension to the SF mythos.

I mean, part of that is the fact that the games she is in broke the mould of what a SF game could be, but I think she just kinda added another dimension on her own.

By that I mean that before the story was: 3 space mercenary dudes (and Slippy ) fly around and blow the crap outta the bad guys with no real additional story other than "Star Fox, the galaxy still needs your help!" (Bonus points for reference )

And there's nothing wrong with that either, no siree.

But, by adding Krystal Nintendo opened up a whole wealth of new story potential and stuff. Krystal obviously adds a love interest, which helps to flesh out Fox's character more and just kind of adds more to the story as a whole. But, Nintendo also gave themselves the perfect opportunity to do a prequel with her backstory; should they so feel inclined. Additionally, Nintendo could employ the Kursed side of Krystal in a darker spin-off.

But the biggest issue facing Krystal is the fact that Nintendo hasn't been willing to commit to fleshing out her character and she has instead been stuck as a bit of a cardboard character. (And this is coming from a major Krystal fan)

That's my feelings on the topic, take it as you please.

[LoneWolf]

My thoughts exactly. I'm sick of seeing female characters defined by their romantic relations to male characters. It's not only demeaning to women, as we hear all the time, but also just plain boring.

True dat.

[Samantha Weltzin]

True dat.

Oh, El Zorro de la Estrella made me think of something Krystal has legitimately added to StarFox. Whether it's good or bad is up for debate, but adding her staff into the mix shows that there is magic in the StarFox universe. That could open up options for how reality works. Will anyone actually capitalize on it? Probably not. But the possibility is there.

[LoneWolf]

Oh, El Zorro de la Estrella made me think of something Krystal has legitimately added to StarFox. Whether it's good or bad is up for debate, but adding her staff into the mix shows that there is magic in the StarFox universe. That could open up options for how reality works. Will anyone actually capitalize on it? Probably not. But the possibility is there.

Hey, that's actually pretty good. Unless her staff is the pinnacle of Cernian technology, some sort of last defense against Andross, lost with Krystal when Cernia was destroyed.

[ZM Anonymous]

Oh, El Zorro de la Estrella made me think of something Krystal has legitimately added to StarFox. Whether it's good or bad is up for debate, but adding her staff into the mix shows that there is magic in the StarFox universe. That could open up options for how reality works. Will anyone actually capitalize on it? Probably not. But the possibility is there.

Although it did add the concept of magic, it didn't really last throughout the series, which I'm kinda glad for because then it would get really confusing once you play through the series. Plus in a sci-fi universe with spaceships and guns, I don't see the staff to be a very effective instrument in gameplay. IDK. To me, it seems more like a gimmick now because you never used the staff ever again. I mean, the only purpose it'd serve after Adventures is a backup weapon when your ammo is depleted.

P.S. Krystal's telepathic powers do not disprove my point!

[Samantha Weltzin]

Although it did add the concept of magic, it didn't really last throughout the series, which I'm kinda glad for because then it would get really confusing once you play through the series. Plus in a sci-fi universe with spaceships and guns, I don't see the staff to be a very effective instrument in gameplay. IDK. To me, it seems more like a gimmick now because you never used the staff ever again. I mean, the only purpose it'd serve after Adventures is a backup weapon when your ammo is depleted.

P.S. Krystal's telepathic powers do not disprove my point!

Like I said, it's debatable whether it was a good or bad thing.

But yeah. It was more or less unheard of through the other two games, so no one really capitalized on the potential it had. I'm a fan of the Star Ocean games, which blend magic and technology quite well, but I will never expect StarFox to be anywhere as good as those are.

Also, about the telepathy, River had telepathy in Firefly, which was purely Sci-Fi, so it can be done, whether your "Does not disprove my point" was in jest or not. :P

[ZM Anonymous]

Like I said, it's debatable whether it was a good or bad thing.

But yeah. It was more or less unheard of through the other two games, so no one really capitalized on the potential it had. I'm a fan of the Star Ocean games, which blend magic and technology quite well, but I will never expect StarFox to be anywhere as good as those are.

Also, about the telepathy, River had telepathy in Firefly, which was purely Sci-Fi, so it can be done, whether your "Does not disprove my point" was in jest or not.

I'm just saying don't confuse psychic abilities with magic like fireballs and stuff like that. They're not the same

[Sabre]

Telepathy, or empathy, whatever, is pretty much just a plot conveniant mcGuffin. Much like the force in Starwars or warp, teleportation and shields in StarTrek, it has no fixed rules and basicly does whatever the plot demands.

[PocketRock]

Okay... I'm lovin' all the harsh criticism Krystal is getting here. ^^

At this point, I'm a little more disappointed Krystal fans are making a big to-do about her joining Star Wolf... I mean joining StarWolf alone makes Krystal ten times cooler in my eyes. Suddenly, she has more balls than Falco as she just ditches the man who freed/saved her AND joins starts dating another man on StarFox's rival team. God... what a way to rip Fox's balls out, Krystal.... I sooooo love strong, female leads. haha B)

Now the next step after joining Star Wolf is to mutiny and create her own squad with Panther and Leon. XD

While that last part may be a bit excessive, it helps explain why I think Krystal COULD BE awesome... if it weren't for some of her obnoxious fan base and general Command haters (though I'm not mad at the latter... heck I sympathize with Command haters). All this hate for Command in general, I hope, doesn't steer Nintendo (or who ever works on the next SF game) away from "Krystal joining StarWolf", cuz I'm lookin' for some REAL character development for that pair of useless "blue furry boobs" and I think joining Star Wolf is IT.

Besides that, [canon] Krystal just doesn't interest me... in-fact the thought of Krystal having Fox's full attention just makes me gag. Especially since Krystal is SUCH a boring character without the endings where she left StarFox for StarWolf, and I'd take Fox and Falco's "dude-bro" mercenary thing they [sorta] had going on in 64 over a boring Fox-loves-Krystal-FOREVER-MARRIEDANDWITHKIDS relationship anyday.

But yes... Krystal can become a real strong female character and I worry the next SF game will go the "fan pleasing" route (which could be a mistake in some areas) instead of taking a risk with her character (and gameplay additions like STORY-MODE CO-OP YEEEEEEEAH).

[Sluggsnipa]

Okay... I'm lovin' all the harsh criticism Krystal is getting here. ^^

At this point, I'm a little more disappointed Krystal fans are making a big to-do about her joining Star Wolf... I mean joining StarWolf alone makes Krystal ten times cooler in my eyes. Suddenly, she has more balls than Falco as she just ditches the man who freed/saved her AND joins starts dating another man on StarFox's rival team. God... what a way to rip Fox's balls out, Krystal.... I sooooo love strong, female leads. haha B)

Now the next step after joining Star Wolf is to mutiny and create her own squad with Panther and Leon. XD

But yes... Krystal can become a real strong female character and I worry the next SF game will go the "fan pleasing" route (which could be a mistake in some areas) instead of taking a risk with her character (and gameplay additions like STORY-MODE CO-OP YEEEEEEEAH).

My god,man you are raising hell,I am pissed off.YOU ARE A TROLL.

I'm not saying this because I dissagree with him,but because he is seemingly obbessed with "B@LLS",Krystal doesn't have to go around breaking hearts and ripping guys balls off to become a strong female character,in fact that's just saying that she's a mean Wh0r3,going around and breaking hearts. AND GTFO of our forums,you troll.

[LoneWolf]

PocketRock, that is some serious trolling right there.

Rabid Krystal Fanboys will tear you apart.

WATCH YOUR BACK.

(This is going to be interesting)

[Xortberg]

Good God, you two. Do not call troll when no troll is present. PocketRock was not trolling, he was stating his - and trust me, this is really good - "Disposition towards Krystal." You know, that thing the topic is all about? Hell. Lrn2recognize trolling.

[Sluggsnipa]

Good God, you two. Do not call troll when no troll is present. PocketRock was not trolling, he was stating his - and trust me, this is really good - "Disposition towards Krystal." You know, that thing the topic is all about? Hell. Lrn2recognize trolling.

He has provoked me,(but just because I am defending Krystal,doesn't mean that I'm a Fur*ag)and it didn't seem to me that he was speaking his opinion,(or speaking it nicely).

And if he is entitled to HIS opinion,than I am entitled to my opinion.

LETS GET BACK ON TOPIC

[Xortberg]

He has provoked me,(but just because I am defending Krystal,doesn't mean that I'm a Fur*ag)and it didn't seem to me that he was speaking his opinion,(or speaking it nicely).

And if he is entitled to HIS opinion,than I am entitled to my opinion.

LETS GET BACK ON TOPIC

He provoked you? More like you overreacted. And yes, he was most definitely speaking his opinion, albeit not in the nicest manner. How you never realized this is beyond me. And finally, nobody ever said you aren't entitled to your own opinion. I just said not to call troll when he's not a damn troll.

[Sluggsnipa]

He provoked you? More like you overreacted. And yes, he was most definitely speaking his opinion, albeit not in the nicest manner. How you never realized this is beyond me. And finally, nobody ever said you aren't entitled to your own opinion. I just said not to call troll when he's not a damn troll.

Xort,If we go ANY further,this might turn into a flame war,so let's just get on topic.

[Xortberg]

I only matched the counterpoints you yourself provided. Also, I dunno about you, but I for one have enough self-control to keep myself from getting into a flamewar, especially over something so trivial.

However, there really is nothing left to say. I'll drop it.

[KokoaMinto]

Krystal was a nice add for the StarFox Franchise, I really liked her from Adventures till Assault, but she doesn't have much of a character development, not even nowadays, she's just... there... and... the love interest of Fox. I can't complain too much about her because I like her (Assault) personality, this calm, serious and carring behaviour, but mostly I like her design - I always liked it. But there are some things that goes on my nerves which doesn't have to do with HER exactly, but it really makes me feel sorry for her. I'm not interested on arguments though, so I stay quiet'n'short with most of my opinions here.

[Blaze the Sage]

I'm with Xort here - he was stating an opinion, and stating it fairly strongly. That is the point of the topic.

The fact that is an opinion that offends you does not make the bearer of the opinion a troll.

In fact, I agree with him on a number of points. As I said earlier, Krystal is a character that, for all the attention the fans give her, Krystal has not received a lot of attention from Nintendo in the personality department. Before Command, the only thing she had going personality-wise was "<3 Fox". Command actually did something with her, and gives her a bit of an emotional extreme. While she is very caring for Fox in Assault, and worrisome (and perhaps a bit frustrated with his incredible shyness), once he pushes her away, she becomes an absolute witch towards Fox - though some plotlines have her willing to sort of forgive him, others have her coming up with the plan that screws Fox over.

Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned.

However, I do disagree with him on one thing: His bit about what she does to Fox, and strong female leads... I don't think so. Being a strong female lead doesn't mean being an asshole to the guy. It means being a strong character. Confident, capable, and emotionally secure. It is not the actions that make a strong character, it is the mindset behind the actions.

[Vulvokunvrii]

I'd say sh was alright, but would have been more impressive if she was more invloved in the games. otherwise no problem ^_^

[Milkyway64]

Okay... I'm lovin' all the harsh criticism Krystal is getting here. ^^

At this point, I'm a little more disappointed Krystal fans are making a big to-do about her joining Star Wolf... I mean joining StarWolf alone makes Krystal ten times cooler in my eyes. Suddenly, she has more balls than Falco as she just ditches the man who freed/saved her AND joins starts dating another man on StarFox's rival team. God... what a way to rip Fox's balls out, Krystal.... I sooooo love strong, female leads. haha B)

Now the next step after joining Star Wolf is to mutiny and create her own squad with Panther and Leon. XD

While that last part may be a bit excessive, it helps explain why I think Krystal COULD BE awesome... if it weren't for some of her obnoxious fan base and general Command haters (though I'm not mad at the latter... heck I sympathize with Command haters). All this hate for Command in general, I hope, doesn't steer Nintendo (or who ever works on the next SF game) away from "Krystal joining StarWolf", cuz I'm lookin' for some REAL character development for that pair of useless "blue furry boobs" and I think joining Star Wolf is IT.

Besides that, [canon] Krystal just doesn't interest me... in-fact the thought of Krystal having Fox's full attention just makes me gag. Especially since Krystal is SUCH a boring character without the endings where she left StarFox for StarWolf, and I'd take Fox and Falco's "dude-bro" mercenary thing they [sorta] had going on in 64 over a boring Fox-loves-Krystal-FOREVER-MARRIEDANDWITHKIDS relationship anyday.

But yes... Krystal can become a real strong female character and I worry the next SF game will go the "fan pleasing" route (which could be a mistake in some areas) instead of taking a risk with her character (and gameplay additions like STORY-MODE CO-OP YEEEEEEEAH).

I love you for a variety of reasons, top of which being you have a cool opinion and drew out comments like this;

My god,man you are raising hell,I am pissed off.YOU ARE A TROLL.

I'm not saying this because I dissagree with him,but because he is seemingly obbessed with "B@LLS",Krystal doesn't have to go around breaking hearts and ripping guys balls off to become a strong female character,in fact that's just saying that she's a mean Wh0r3,going around and breaking hearts. AND GTFO of our forums,you troll.

PocketRock, that is some serious trolling right there.

Rabid Krystal Fanboys will tear you apart.

WATCH YOUR BACK.

(This is going to be interesting)

As Xort has kindly pointed out, this isn't trolling. Why IS it trolling? Just tell me why you are so offended that someone can actually rationally analyze a character?

[Samantha Weltzin]

He has provoked me,(but just because I am defending Krystal,doesn't mean that I'm a Fur*ag)and it didn't seem to me that he was speaking his opinion,(or speaking it nicely).

And if he is entitled to HIS opinion,than I am entitled to my opinion.

LETS GET BACK ON TOPIC

He did not provoke you. You were irritated, sure, but that's not the same thing as him trying to provoke you. He didn't say, "Hey Sluggsnipa, your views on Krystal suck. Shut the hell up and get off my forum." You said that to him. I'm not going to be so base as to say that you are a troll, as I know that you are not, but to target a single user with such venom certainly isn't the most courteous course of action.

If you disagree with him? Fine. Explain your reasons why he's wrong.

And don't go telling Blaze, Milky, and me to "get back on topic." This is called an evolution of a topic. Soon enough it will burn out and go away, but it is a legitimate point about forum etiquette that shouldn't be censored by someone who is (or ought to be anyway) embarrassed with the way he acted. I recommend just biting the bullet and letting it die yourself. Stay away from the topic for a few days and let it run its course. It'll get back to where you want it to be soon enough.

[Dublinthefox]

Okay... I'm lovin' all the harsh criticism Krystal is getting here. ^^

At this point, I'm a little more disappointed Krystal fans are making a big to-do about her joining Star Wolf... I mean joining StarWolf alone makes Krystal ten times cooler in my eyes. Suddenly, she has more balls than Falco as she just ditches the man who freed/saved her AND joins starts dating another man on StarFox's rival team. God... what a way to rip Fox's balls out, Krystal.... I sooooo love strong, female leads. haha B)

Now the next step after joining Star Wolf is to mutiny and create her own squad with Panther and Leon. XD

While that last part may be a bit excessive, it helps explain why I think Krystal COULD BE awesome... if it weren't for some of her obnoxious fan base and general Command haters (though I'm not mad at the latter... heck I sympathize with Command haters). All this hate for Command in general, I hope, doesn't steer Nintendo (or who ever works on the next SF game) away from "Krystal joining StarWolf", cuz I'm lookin' for some REAL character development for that pair of useless "blue furry boobs" and I think joining Star Wolf is IT.

Besides that, [canon] Krystal just doesn't interest me... in-fact the thought of Krystal having Fox's full attention just makes me gag. Especially since Krystal is SUCH a boring character without the endings where she left StarFox for StarWolf, and I'd take Fox and Falco's "dude-bro" mercenary thing they [sorta] had going on in 64 over a boring Fox-loves-Krystal-FOREVER-MARRIEDANDWITHKIDS relationship anyday.

But yes... Krystal can become a real strong female character and I worry the next SF game will go the "fan pleasing" route (which could be a mistake in some areas) instead of taking a risk with her character (and gameplay additions like STORY-MODE CO-OP YEEEEEEEAH).

[PocketRock]

My god,man you are raising hell,I am pissed off.YOU ARE A TROLL.

I'm not saying this because I dissagree with him,but because he is seemingly obbessed with "B@LLS",Krystal doesn't have to go around breaking hearts and ripping guys balls off to become a strong female character,in fact that's just saying that she's a mean Wh0r3,going around and breaking hearts. AND GTFO of our forums,you troll.

Wowza. This caught me off gaurd (but thinking back, I understand your reaction), so I'll talk directly to you for a moment... Trust me I'm not going to flame you, despite whatever my earlier language suggested of me.

I don't want Krystal to become an unfeeling heart breaker. No. The goal of my post was to see Krystal find a new role she could play (so to speak), a role where she can garner more respect for herself AND from others. I apologize for hurting any feelings there, but Krystal (as I see it) should be able to fall into other (newer) roles than the current ones given to her. You... kinda jumped the gun on that one man. I'm a very friendly guy, trying to have a deep discussion, not an argument. I guess my language was more "out-of-left-field" than I intended, which caught you, Sluggsnipa, and others off-guard (which is also why I'm guessing you were expecting a troll or a flame war to start). I apologize to you... but I do not agree with the way you responded to me out of your anger. Oh no. But... this IS just an online forum, so... I don't mind it.

Now to pick apart Krystal's character

Canon-wise (since Command endings technically aren't canon) Krystal simply isn't... the best character... but she also isn't the worst character (no matter how harsh I may criticize her). Krystal was just there. Her powers a bit of a plot device. Eye Candy. And a means for Fox McCloud to have a woman at some point in his lifetime (a life where he's out in space and usually is surrounded by other men). If any parts of those endings fall through to the next SF game, Krystal may finally have something else to do besides being a love interest/girl friend, and THAT is what matters most about her future. Having something else to do.

Her harsh actions more so opens doors for her to fit into stronger female role(s) later on... out of all the possibilities, we'll just have to wait and see what Nintendo wants to do with her. But breaking a man's heart does not make her strong (I was wrong there), like Slugsnippa and Blaze the Sage said.

However, I do disagree with him on one thing: His bit about what she does to Fox, and strong female leads... I don't think so. Being a strong female lead doesn't mean being an asshole to the guy. It means being a strong character. Confident, capable, and emotionally secure. It is not the actions that make a strong character, it is the mindset behind the actions.

I guess I jumped the gun on passing Krystal off as a strong character earlier, you're right about what makes a strong female lead.

I was too busy reading into Krystal's string-of-harsh-decisions to think Krystal wasn't seeking to simply empower herself. She was mainly seeking revenge. If she's suddenly an asshole to Fox (after a couple games of being smitten by him) that doesn't mean she's suddenly become a cold heart breaker or a strong female character. I see that now. It's just what she faced to get what she wanted that impresses me.

I will go out on a limb (again) to say that those harsh actions she made opens doors for her character to become stronger in future games. Krystal did something most people would be afraid to do. Dumping your lover and rebounding with another person who is on a team (or with a group of people) your-now-Ex-lover so very much despises, AND NOT BEING VERY PRIVATE ABOUT IT. What Krystal did there was gutsy, and if it's built upon in the next game, I love it. It showed Krystal has great courage above all else. Let me explain that. Besides leaving Fox for Panther, just the action of walking away from team StarFox (good) to team StarWolf (bad, possibly not evil) must've been so hard of a decision for her to make. Especially if it was making headlines. Like in the SFC ending where Krystal becomes Kursed. She was torn down in public (by the general public and possibly by Lylatian media as well) after joining StarWolf, and she broke down and fled the spotlight to live on her own. Then she came back from that by completely re-inventing herself instead of just disappearing forever. From those endings in Command, where Krystal left Fox, I drew my initial ideas about Krystal becoming a "strong female lead". In those endings, Krystal was being brave by risking public ridicule just to fulfill her own needs... you gotta at least admit she didn't give up at any one point, she looked for (and found) a solution. It does speak a lot about Krystal's strength as a person by choosing to go down a pretty damn hard path to go down. Getting publicly insulted is not pretty in any degree.

Also, I'm a guy myself, so I don't hate Fox (or other men for that matter haha). When I praised Krystal for stomping on Fox's heart, I wasn't happy at what she did to Fox, I was happy for what she did for herself. Though I'm not a female rights activist, pre-Command Krystal was kinda given a pathetically cliche'd role, what she does in Command kinda broke that role.

One thing I should mention, it's not like Krystal didn't bring anything interesting to the SF universe. With her came the concept of magic, and if done right, it can flow very well with the Star Fox universe (or at least make it more fun). Telepathy is another thing... very Sci-fi.

As a final few words, yeah, I was speaking in a very harsh manner. I was not intending to start up a flame war though. I did not anticipate for the tone of my initial post to be so infuriating to some (though, duh, I should have realized that). I am one of the nicest, gentle guys you can get to know (in person), and I was using harsh language to give my post a lighter tone (so-to-speak) and still show I have a strong opinion. I am glad I got my message across though, and have received friendly feedback from some of the posters here. You guys are great. :)