Female Pervert

[Sabre]

Does it exsist?

A number of things have annoied me the last couple of days. One of those things is something I have been aware of for years. A double standard where a man is a pervert, but women are excused for some reason. For example-

A man reads Yuri, he's a pervert, but a women reads Yoai because it's 'sweet' and 'cute'.

A man judges a woman on looks, he's shallow, but a woman does it and she is 'particular'.

A man gropes a woman, he's a pervert. A woman gropes a man, it's 'just a laugh'.

you get the idea.

There was a fag-hag (a straight woman who hangs around gay men) the other day who was, for lack of better word, out of control. To cut a long story short any guy tried to pull what she did that day would never get away with it.

I'm wondering, what are the male equiverlents? ie. What can men get away with that women can't.

I'm also interested on hearing from the female members on what there thoughts are on this type of behaviour.

[Fluxy]

I am glad to be able to say, yeah, there is something men can pretty much get away with.

Sleeping around [for the most part. Just like what you are saying, Saber, is for the most part].

The saying goes like this. A key that can undo many locks, is a great key, but a lock that opens to many keys, is a shitty lock.

If you don't get what that means, then more than likely you shouldn't post in this thread, lol.

Either way, complaining that one sex gets away with something is still rather stupid overall, as both can get away with things. My female co-worker, who has known the boss for much much less than I, and has many less qualifications, still gets more hours than me. Why? My boss even said because she was female. Alright, she at least was open to it, and the job is so easy I don't have right to complain anyway even if I wanted to. But what is the up side? I -also- don't get fired like she did because she went on a period rage on a kid at work. So yes, there are special benefits to both sexs.

[Psygonis]

There is an asymmetry in term of behaviors because men and women are asymmetrically seen by the society.

Whatever ladies are nowadays, they carry centuries of "values" and stereotypes.

Your enumeration of situations in rather incomplete on that regard.

For instance, a man that attracts many girls' attention is "successful", a woman who does so is a "slut".

Actually, the lists could go way longer, on both sides.

But you are right that when it comes to actual actions, women are usually more easily forgiven or sympathized with than men. A recent event that really showed that is the Russian female shopkeeper that neutralized a male burglar, kept him tied naked in the backside of it for days, only to be sexually abused and fed with nothing but Viagra pills.

And for everyone, she did good, the bad guy got what he deserved and so on and so forth...

You could imagine the public opinion if a male shopkeeper had done a tenth of that to a female burglar!

Same when an exasperated wife cut her husband's penis in rage. She got away from justice with it because the jury empathized with her (genuinely) tough housewife situation. I mean... she cut a human being's organ off! What da'...?!?

In a more quiet and dailylife register, two girls hanging around by the arms are "best friends", may they be lesbians or just actual friends. Try to do the same with a male friend of yours... XD

People are judged along the values they carry (or are thought to carry). So males, fundamentally sex-driven being are easily said to be perverts, while females aren't. That is stupid and sexist in a way, but that's how it is at the moment... But opinions change over time, so maybe at some point, people will be seen as they are as a person, and not as a gender/skin color/religion/etc...

[Sabre]

I am glad to be able to say, yeah, there is something men can pretty much get away with.

Sleeping around [for the most part. Just like what you are saying, Saber, is for the most part].

The saying goes like this. A key that can undo many locks, is a great key, but a lock that opens to many keys, is a shitty lock.

I wanted to avoid talking about that because, it's not exactly forum friendly. Also, that is a 2 way street of sorts due to a recent american import. To use your metaphore, a key that hasn't opened any locks is clearly bad and must never come into contact with any lock ever. Plus the concept of shitty locks is on the decline it seems as shitty locks are now quite popular. I understand the opposate is true across the pond as your example shows. Anyway, that's a minor thing. I was thinking more along the lines of what Psygonis was saying.

Same when an exasperated wife cut her husband's penis in rage. She got away from justice with it because the jury empathized with her (genuinely) tough housewife situation. I mean... she cut a human being's organ off! What da'...?!?

off topic, but I heard she cut it off because he asked for a devorce.

Your enumeration of situations in rather incomplete on that regard.

For instance, a man that attracts many girls' attention is "successful", a woman who does so is a "slut".

Actually, the lists could go way longer, on both sides.

Yes, I know, I want it more complete which is why I was asking if they exsist. Specifically what can men get away with that women can't.

[Redeemer]

Does it exsist?

A number of things have annoied me the last couple of days. One of those things is something I have been aware of for years. A double standard where a man is a pervert, but women are excused for some reason. For example-

A man reads Yuri, he's a pervert, but a women reads Yoai because it's 'sweet' and 'cute'.

A man judges a woman on looks, he's shallow, but a woman does it and she is 'particular'.

A man gropes a woman, he's a pervert. A woman gropes a man, it's 'just a laugh'.

you get the idea.

Um, I don't agree with some of these. The reason most of my friends are guys is because women are bitchy, and I don't tolerate judgemental women. Not that I'm not bitchy in my own way, but I am aware that I'm different from most women.

Yaoi-readers simply baffle and slightly disturb me, and in my eyes, a woman that gropes men is just out of order, just as men that grope are also out of order. Perhaps society sees things differently, but these are just my opinions.

Men get away with, from what I can see, sleeping around and various sexual behaviours that are considered the norm. Look at the metaphor Fluxy provided, that was written up by a man to give a reason as to why men are allowed to sleep around, and women aren't. Also, look at magazines. Nuts, Zoo, Playboy. They exist for visual pleasure, and as far as I can see, women don't really have a version of their own.

[Xortberg]

*Comment removed*

Edited August 8, 2011 by Asper Sarnoff
That was an unnecesary personal attack that didn't contribute to the discussion at hand. Please refrain from that in the future.

[Thu'um]

i posted in my journal not to long ago that one girl dated like 7 guys in 3 weeks and then evey one condemed her a slut, so it all comes around

["User"]

i posted in my journal not to long ago that one girl dated like 7 guys in 3 weeks and then evey one condemed her a slut, so it all comes around

I know a girl like that from Michigan. She was all over me two weeks after a tournament that me and her played in and was wanting me to come down to Detroit for a weekend and stay with her, even though she had a BF. >_>

[Vy'drach]

Also, look at magazines. Nuts, Zoo, Playboy. They exist for visual pleasure, and as far as I can see, women don't really have a version of their own.

I've heard tell of "Playgirl," but I have never seen one offered for sale anywhere.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Playgirl

Also, haven't heard of Nuts or Zoo. Bad mental images now...

[Thu'um]

I've heard tell of "Playgirl," but I have never seen one offered for sale anywhere.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Playgirl

Also, haven't heard of Nuts or Zoo. Bad mental images now...

never heard of any of these, but i am scared

[Fluxy]

If people really need studies though to prove this thought, I find it almost and practically, silly.

It is obvious men have certain benefits and that women have certain unique ones as well. [Physically even. If we men wanted to, we could become much stronger than women, simply by working out. We were made that way {to be more expendable aka} and well, women... Get that unflattering time of the month that can make them really really really annoying to some degree.] To really make a science and try to sound smart about it is really unnecessary.

Either way, Psygonis did so, so yeah.... Cool stuff. But let's not get this topic starting more drama please. kthxbai.

[Sabre]

Nut's and Zoo are so called 'lads mags' and are basicly a mix of bikini clad/topless woman, cars, sport ect. I've never seen anyone read them, but I put that down to people being to dumb to read.

Um, I don't agree with some of these. The reason most of my friends are guys is because women are bitchy, and I don't tolerate judgemental women. Not that I'm not bitchy in my own way, but I am aware that I'm different from most women.

Yaoi-readers simply baffle and slightly disturb me, and in my eyes, a woman that gropes men is just out of order, just as men that grope are also out of order. Perhaps society sees things differently, but these are just my opinions.

Men get away with, from what I can see, sleeping around and various sexual behaviours that are considered the norm. Look at the metaphor Fluxy provided, that was written up by a man to give a reason as to why men are allowed to sleep around, and women aren't. Also, look at magazines. Nuts, Zoo, Playboy. They exist for visual pleasure, and as far as I can see, women don't really have a version of their own.

I never thought of that. The magazines I mean.

[kkstarfox]

There is no double standard. Both men and women look at porn. Both men and women can get in trouble with sexual harassment charges. The problem is men are generally unwilling to admit they have been sexually harassed. That's unmanly! Things come around, and the woman who pulls that stuff, will be treated as the person she really is by her peers.

[Thu'um]

Yes lets not forget when a man has a rage its sorta overlooked, but when a women has an anger she becomes sterio typed as unlady like or a B*tch

[Drasiana]

Anyone who's been to an anime convention knows that female perverts are prevalent. And I actually mean "awkward obsessive crazy bitches who don't know the meaning of personal boundaries", and not just towards men. There's a reason many cons are banning "glomping" and the dreaded "yaoi/yuri paddle". What also pisses me off about yaoi fangirls is the tendency for them to think "yaoi is so super kawaii but yuri is just fantasies for icky gross perverted men!"...not to mention the disturbing way these girls glorify rape, but I digress.

What KK said about men being more unwilling to complain about sexual harassment is accurate, though depressing on both ends of the gender spectrum. Bad for men because they'd be ostracized for complaining about a very real problem, but they're being ostracized because it's only "okay" for women to be sexually harassed. A man "loses his mancard" for complaining, so that makes him...a woman? And this is apparently a bad thing. So the worst thing a man can be is, apparently, a woman. And this is why both genders should be outraged that female sex offenses, and any degradation towards men like that, are not taken seriously.

The worst are women who take advantage of this. This is a bit of a tangent, not necessarily sexual harassment but harassment all the same, and an example of what annoys me: The other day I watched, from my room, a woman harass and attack a man that had accidentally spilled something on her. She chased him down the street, screamed at him, kicked him, and called her boyfriend down to beat him up (the guy socked the poor dude in the face). The man managed to call the police beforehand (my phone was dead but thankfully others had theirs on-hand), and the second the cops rounded the corner she burst into tears crying about how the man HIT HER. Of course, me and the others watching from my building, as well as others in the street, screamed bullshit (he might have wacked in self-defence after she JUMPED ON HIM), but everyone flocked to the poor widdle defenseless girl who was clearly taking advantage of her gender to get off scott free. All three of them wound up being released, and I wasn't sure what medium they reached, but the way that woman acted--attacking some guy for some petty bullshit, telling him he was a "faggot" and "not a man", then playing the victim when she got called out--put me into a bit of a rage mode.

I'm just thankful everyone watching didn't buy that shit. But what if none of us saw what happened?

Both genders, in general terms, like sex and porn. There's nothing really wrong with that given the natural circumstances of it, and there's nothing wrong with either gender admitting it. But where the double-standard comes from is that, yes, men have taken advantage of women for a lot longer than the vise-versa. That does NOT mean it's okay for women to manipulate people based on the societal standards for their sexuality, but it's at least something for a reason. I don't think a lot of women have really grasped it to both extremes; that they're allowed to be sexual, but that in that way they're the same as men. And that's (all safety and consent considered) okay.

Things men can get away with that women can't (at least easily)?

Sleeping around. Men do it, they're playa's, women do it, they're sluts.

Playing most sports, or doing construction, or something of the like, unless you want to be labelled a bulldyke (homophobia too!)

Entry into any male-dominated industry without being expected to lend a "female perspective" or be treated like they won the fucking special olympics for getting where they did.

Example, on the last one (under the cut for longness and it doesn't relate DIRECTLY to sexuality):

Dras writes a story, and Dras workshops the story. The story happens to have a female protagonist, for the general reason of humorously exaggerating the ratio between female gamers and female game industry workers (half of gamers are female but only about 10% of the industry are women), and that is background to the actual story itself. In any case, as Dras has this workshopped, who does she have it done through? Men. Lots of men. And many of them are quite a bit older than her.

Almost EVERY one of them are baffled that this story is not one of GRRL POWER and about how it SHOULD be a story about how you can be in "a man's world" while "lending your feminine perspective". "Also, she should get romantically involved with the villain". Because a man and woman can't have a relationship in media without sexual overtones! The thing is, the story was not a gender battle. And the thing is, neither are the stories of most actual women, nor should they be. This happened to me in person too; "Dras wants to write a video game? That's lovely, there DO need to be more games for girls, from a female perspective!" Female perspective? Fuck you, do you think I give two shits about or really even get the concept of whatever the fuck a "female perspective" is? Do you think I sit there, fingers-to-keyboard about to write my shit, and consult my crotch on whether or not the story is a good enough reflection of my chromosomes? I think ladies like Marianne Krawczyk seem to be doing alright, considering the "female" thing and all.

And yes, you read that right. The God of War series, starring one of the beefiest, most rediculously over-the-top-manly and liked modern game protagonists, is written by someone with a vagina.

So where am I going with this. I guess it's just one way to say that, hey, the laws aren't different for men and women, and people should--PEOPLE--should uphold that. And girls, stop making a spectacle out of the fact that you're a chick. THAT DOES NOT DEFINE YOU.

SO TL;DR:

It's not about "being a man" or "being a woman", it's about being decent goddamned people. No one should give a shit about what's in your pants. You also should not use what's in your pants to get your way, male or female, and unfortunately both genders have their share of this occuring. Stop it.

The sooner we all realize the opposite sex isn't some unknowable alien race, the better off we are.

[Fluxy]

This is a wall of text that I read and agree with, and can really back that up to the full degree. But, at the moment, Lazyness is my ally in the night so I wish not to harm him and bring his nemesis, Awakeness.

[Sabre]

I won't quote directly due to length.

I have never heard of the paddle before, and given what google has to say I'm suprised that even exsists. The thing about rape I've not come across in an anime context, but domestic violence definatly. I mentioned before on this forum about the best example one anime where a guy comes home from work, goes to the bathroom in his own house and get's beaten up by the woman in there who hospitalizes him. It get's more crazy when her excuse is "her toilet broke" so she broke into his house, used the toilet with the door open, and didn't shout anything when she heard him come home. This scene is played for laughs by the way.

Off topic. The sexual harrassment thing reminds me of the saying "Only ugly people get accussed of sexual harrassment". On a more serious note the domestic violence story is no uncommon here either, where it seems to work on a guilty until proven innocent type basis to the point where some women use the police as heavies.

The game developer ratio of men and women is something for another topic, but my opinion on the matter is nothing is stopping them, just more women don't want to do it. It's not like it's an old boys club that exsisted before womens lib. Now it's hard for women to get in because it's hard for everyone to get in, being more about who you know, not what you know so that early imbalence is preserved.

But yes, these double standards shouldn't happen.

[Drasiana]

I have never heard of the paddle before, and given what google has to say I'm suprised that even exsists. The thing about rape I've not come across in an anime context, but domestic violence definatly. I mentioned before on this forum about the best example one anime where a guy comes home from work, goes to the bathroom in his own house and get's beaten up by the woman in there who hospitalizes him. It get's more crazy when her excuse is "her toilet broke" so she broke into his house, used the toilet with the door open, and didn't shout anything when she heard him come home. This scene is played for laughs by the way.

Yeah. The Hetalia fandom is particularly bad but they're constantly saying such dumb shit like "oooh Arthur-kun is so hot I just want to rape him >:3". WTF. If a dude said that they'd flip their absolute shit. I mean. I have a dark sense of humour, and will laugh at all sorts of inappropriateness, but seriously, I'm not going to talk about HOW MUCH I WANT TO RAPE SOMEONE casually with people I don't know. Not to mention I've seen stupid fangirls arguing about how "rape doesn't REALLY mean bad stuff anymore!". Ugh. Stupid damn weebs.

Anime is its own gigantic bucket of misogyny and I think the most important thing people need to remember is that ANIME IS NOT REAL LIFE. Please, for the love of humanity, get this through your weebish heads.

Off topic. The sexual harrassment thing reminds me of the saying "Only ugly people get accussed of sexual harrassment". On a more serious note the domestic violence story is no uncommon here either, where it seems to work on a guilty until proven innocent type basis to the point where some women use the police as heavies.

Yeeep. I read a bunch of stories by a female former-emergency paramedic, and also a feminist, who talked about all the instances of domestic abuse she encountered and how the ones where the males were the victims were never taken seriously. It's pretty sad.

The game developer ratio of men and women is something for another topic, but my opinion on the matter is nothing is stopping them, just more women don't want to do it. It's not like it's an old boys club that exsisted before womens lib. Now it's hard for women to get in because it's hard for everyone to get in, being more about who you know, not what you know so that early imbalence is preserved.

It's actually not hard for women to get into the industry itself, I don't think. They're always open to it. But it is that women don't necessarily see it as a career option all the time, for whatever reason, and a lot of that is from social stigma. It's fine if you play games casually but when people think about it as a career path, there's a lot of parental/peer pressure and people don't take it seriously, or consider you some kind of delusional lesbian or some other retarded thing because girls don't play video games! Most of what I was told was actually from people who didn't actually know much about the industry at all, and they were just ASSUMING that this whole "female perspective" thing was in hot demand because they ASSUME girls don't play video games. Hell, even GIRLS assume girls don't play video games, hence your legions of stupid special snowflakes on deviantArt proclaiming how they're a GRRL GAMR AND PROWD.

[Sabre]

How much of that is related to the weakening of words in general though? I don't hear it often, but I have overheard conversations where people say 'rape' instead of 'good'. "Oh, he tackled that player right before he reached the goal, it was total rape."

[Drasiana]

It's the word and the context it's used in. Hell, I use "rape" like that all the time.

When it's MEANT sexually, though, as in yaoi fangirls going "oh it's so kawaii when gilbo rapes roderich!", then...yeah no.